Claybrook/Ski School/Patrol Only

[MntMan4Bush]

Oh and by the way SRO Dawn is a "he". I've met him a few times and despite what opinion many of you may have formed from the thread he's a nice guy and does care about the mountain.

[ScoobySnack]

Excellent first post, Jacksun.

[sgottmann]

It seems to me that the perks given to Claybrook owners are a way to compete with the private clubs and other deals that are provided at other mountains. For example, at Stratton, there is tiered pass structure and private club. I believe the private club members, in addition to their own lodge, have access to the lifts before the lifts open to the general public. Talk about devastating on a powder day (the perception more than the reality). Clearly, there is a demand for these special perks. I am sure that many purchasers at Sugarbush have owned at other resorts and expect these amenities. Win has clearly expressed that the sale of the remaining CB units is essential for other improvements at Sugarbush. The market for high end condo sales is not limitless. I hope the remaining units sell and look forward to the new GH buildings and ultimately improved lifts and snowmaking. While I hate waiting in line as much as the next person, I just don't get the anger over the fact that some have access to a shorter line. It's a necessary evil to compete and succeed in difficult business. Hopefully, the number of people with special access remains low or at the very least, that I am able to obtain the special privileges (I wouldn't mind a place at CB and would make excellent use of that hot tub and pool). If the ski experience is greatly diminished by the new policy to a point that SV suffers econimically, I am sure Win will cancel the policy. I guess I am supply side trickle down skier that accepts that the sale of high end condos is what leads to infrastructure improvements on the mountain.

Stay warm.

[Tin Woodsman]

Well put Jackson. That is exactly what irks me personally. In fact I almost posted something similar, but wasn't sure if anyone else would get it. In my travels I've found that anywhere west of Turkey has only a marginal concept of lines and the further west you go it decreases exponentially. When I travel and often get pushed and shoved in lines and out right cut by people who think that the rest of us are standing around because we couldn't see the space on either side of the objective not crowded with people I just shrug and let it go. I'm traveling to their environment and culture and it's a way of life. It doesn't bother me at all. (Well not any more once I got used to it) East of Turkey is the opposite where line courtesy is understood. Take England. They love a good queue and will often hop in a line even when there is nothing at the end of it.

England is East of Turkey? I knoew that globe I bought looked funny.

Personally, I'd put the line at the English channel - not much line courtesy when skiing on the Continent.

So when I'm in a place where line priority is an understood concept and someone goes around it the perception as opposed to the real effect bothers me. I'm not going to let it effect my day, but it does bother me. As I've stated before I think it has minimal impact on even the busiest of days in the most extreme of circumstances. Oh well.

And this is just the point I'm making. It's perfectly OK to be disappointed or upset with this policy. It is an affront to both our cultural norms and the vibe which attracts many of us to SB. But there isn't any evidence to support the contention that the problem is going to be anything more than one of principle rather than reality on the slopes. If this helps SV sell another condo or two, and it doesn't impact my skiing life in the least, I don't see what the problem is. All I care about are the types of on-mountain improvements those condo sales can help fund.

[MntMan4Bush]

Correction. Thanks Tin. East of Turkey = no line, west if Turkey = lines. I've chosen Turkey as the Line Meridian just based on personal experience. Though maybe I could be convinced to move it over on my next map drawing.

[gone.skiing]

Disagreeing with policy is one thing, painting Sugarbush owners and employees as not caring about the rest of the customers based on this policy is completely different. If you have been at Sugarbush that long, you know the facts and this one policy is not going to change that all of a sudden.

DP, do you really believe the edits in your signature line? Would you tell it face to face to Win, Egan, Atkinson, snowmaking crew, patrol, Blazer coaches?

[Hawk]

MntMan4Bush wrote:
Bottom line is Dawn has a grievance about something and he's bringing it up. Everyone then loves to jump in and call people childlike or whiners.

That is because he sounds like a crybaby with an axe to grind. People have managed to bring up issues and get them resolved in the past without questioning SV's motives or integrity in the way DP (or is that DB) is doing now.

As mentioned a couple of times Dawn Patrol is a she, not a he. If you genuinely suffer from Gendlexia, instead of he/she just type in the poster's username. Thanks

Wait a minute. Where was that? What Page? I missed it. Just quote it for me please.

[ridelikeme]

I hope all the posters here are self employed if "working". If not You ARE stealing from Your employer. One peek and a post is one thing, but some of You are too much.

are you for real?????
get over yourself.

[Strat]

@Hawk: See the top of this page. The correction has been corrected

[madhavok]

I wouldn't say Sugarbush owners and employees don't care about the rest of the customer base. Obviously they depend on everyone's business. Still hard to argue that Claybrook’s interests aren’t being put first (right or wrong put aside).

[Hawk]

Thanks

[Tin Woodsman]

I wouldn't say Sugarbush owners and employees don't care about the rest of the customer base. Obviously they depend on everyone's business. Still hard to argue that Claybrook’s interests aren’t being put first (right or wrong put aside).

Yes, they are being put first, as with the hot tub, the pool, the ski valet etc.. Now, you don't expect those services when you buy your ticket. OK. So the question becomes, despite how you may be personally annoyed by this policy, does it have an actual impact on your day to day skiing experience, or is it just a perceived problem with no real world impact? I think the majority of people here are saying it's the latter of the two. If this results in hordes of Clay Brookers and their friends/relatives descending on the Bravo and GH lift lines, delaying passage for everyone else significantly (or even consistently), I'll be right there besides you manning the barricades with pitch fork and torch in hand. Until then, not so much.

[gone.skiing]

I wouldn't say Sugarbush owners and employees don't care about the rest of the customer base. Obviously they depend on everyone's business. Still hard to argue that Claybrook’s interests aren’t being put first (right or wrong put aside).

Again generalization based on this single policy. By making this statement you are dismissing all the work ski school, patrol, guest services, owners, etc., who could care less if you are a CB member, are doing. Are you seriously not able to name 50 good things about Sugarbush that benefit everyone for this one policy that puts CB members first without (arguably) much impact on everyone else?

[tomthumb]

It's reasonable to assume that 3-4 people occupy a typical 1 BR or studio. It's reasonable to assume that the avg 2 BR unit has 6 people in it. That's pretty standard - in Calcutta. It's reasonable to assume that all 61 units are occupied and their owners are at SB even though only 53 have been sold in full or in part. Then on top of that, it's reasonable to assume that all sold units have 4 owners, all of whom are up on a normal weekend. Finally, it's entirely reasonable to assume that friends and distant relatives will be eligible for the passes despite several statements to the contrary from people who know.

Tin, I'm going to jump into the fire here to give some perspective. I'm a real estate broker, and have sold some of the resales @ Clay Brook. Here are a few examples of owners, and their respective unit and family size. A single woman purchased a studio, so she'ls got 1 cutter pass. A family (husband, wife & 1 child) are also purchasing a studio, so 3 cutter passes for the same sized unit. Yet another family purchased a 3 bedroom (husband, wife, 2 kids), so 4 cutter passes in a 3 bedroom unit. Another example is a couple that purchased a 2 bedroom, so 2 cutter passes in a 2 bedroom unit. Now I'm sure there are some large families that fill every pillow in their unit, but I don't think it's the norm.

The other factor that has not been mentioned, is that very often these Clay Brook owners will be bringing guests and extened family that will not have access to the cutter passes. Will they ditch their family/friends and say "meet 'cha at the top," or will they wait in line and ride the lift with their guests? I'd hope the later! Unless they're trying to ditch their in-laws or something I would never do that . . .

[barkbiter]

No worries barkbiter, I wouldn't expect you to know what a dawn patrol was...

You wouldn't have a clue now would you ma'am ?