VH chair and some poor decision making

[madhavok]

Why is the Valley house chair closed for the rest of the season? I thought it was stated in an old thread (last year) that Valley House chair runs on Saturdays & holidays, but all other days would be kept ready to operate in case Bravo went down.....

[Tin Woodsman]

Good question. The answer I heard from three different people/CB owners was that VH char failed inspection and is down for the remainder of the year. If this is true, it will be good to know whether they can reasonably expect to re-open it in future years until replaced but, either way, it's an unacceptable outcome. Sure could have come in handy Sunday morning when everything but GH and CR was on windhold to start off. Even after Bravo started up, the lines were nuts until after lunch. How does the mtn let this happen, especially in light of the inspection/software issues delaying things in December?

The other rookie move was the decision to close off all or most of BOTH Lower Snowball/Racers Edge and Spring Fling to the skiing public in favor of gates/racers. Those are without question the two most popular trails on that side of the hill and the only legitimate intermediate options to the skiers right of Murphy's Glade. How on Earth does the mountain make the decision to close these runs mostly or entirely on a busy March weekend? There really isn't much of an excuse for this. If the answer is "commitments to the racing programs", then you've got too many commitments - it's that simple. This sort of thing can work mid-week. Not on busy March weekends when you've received 3 feet of snow since Tuesday. I can't believe that a decision this poor and this antithetical to the skiing experience of the target demographic was made.

And then there were the gates set up on the bottom pitch below VH lodge for the kids. It was fun for them I'm sure, especially with Egan on the play by play, but with the lines for Bravo absolutely nuts, it didn't make sense - there was no room there at all. Of course, had the VH double been running, perhaps there would have been more room.....

I'm a big fan of Summit Ventures and what they are doing for the mountain, the valley and everything in between. But these issues are real disappointments relative to the standards they surely aspire to and, more importantly, to what SB customers should expect. It's not good enough to be in the lift maze directing traffic. It's just not.

[madhavok]

Tin, I was going to bring this up, but my ski day ended so great on Sunday I actually forgot about it.

I was very ticked off that both spring fling & lower snowball were closed to the public. Especially since I had guests up Sunday (1st time to SB) that only ski cruisers. I don't like it, but if Sugarbush closes one OK, but both of them? That was a bad decision.

[HowieT2]

Good question. The answer I heard from three different people/CB owners was that VH char failed inspection and is down for the remainder of the year. If this is true, it will be good to know whether they can reasonably expect to re-open it in future years until replaced but, either way, it's an unacceptable outcome. Sure could have come in handy Sunday morning when everything but GH and CR was on windhold to start off. Even after Bravo started up, the lines were nuts until after lunch. How does the mtn let this happen, especially in light of the inspection/software issues delaying things in December?

The other rookie move was the decision to close off all or most of BOTH Lower Snowball/Racers Edge and Spring Fling to the skiing public in favor of gates/racers. Those are without question the two most popular trails on that side of the hill and the only legitimate intermediate options to the skiers right of Murphy's Glade. How on Earth does the mountain make the decision to close these runs mostly or entirely on a busy March weekend? There really isn't much of an excuse for this. If the answer is "commitments to the racing programs", then you've got too many commitments - it's that simple. This sort of thing can work mid-week. Not on busy March weekends when you've received 3 feet of snow since Tuesday. I can't believe that a decision this poor and this antithetical to the skiing experience of the target demographic was made.

And then there were the gates set up on the bottom pitch below VH lodge for the kids. It was fun for them I'm sure, especially with Egan on the play by play, but with the lines for Bravo absolutely nuts, it didn't make sense - there was no room there at all. Of course, had the VH double been running, perhaps there would have been more room.....

I'm a big fan of Summit Ventures and what they are doing for the mountain, the valley and everything in between. But these issues are real disappointments relative to the standards they surely aspire to and, more importantly, to what SB customers should expect. It's not good enough to be in the lift maze directing traffic. It's just not.

Agree about the VH lift. I had noticed previously that there were a number of broken chairs which were just being left like they were. On weekends/holidays it is vital especially when there are wind hold issues. It is also psychological warfare to be standing on a huge line at the Super Bravo while gazing wistfully at the dormant VH lift. I'm hoping that if it is, in fact, down for the rest of the season, that is a good sign that the replacement is actually going to happen.
However, I didn't think the kids bear race was that obtrusive. Can't kill the mtn for having something like that. Just bad timing with the way the lift situation worked out. Once the Valley House is no more, there will be room for stuff like that.

[arc1]

I think the closure of the VH chair can be put down as 'budget hold". I don't doubt the mechanical issues, but I don't think that, especially given the time if season we're entering, SV will go to heroic measures to reopen this season.

The kids race is a time honored tradition that the kids love, not a big deal to traffic flow that had already ground to a halt.

Sunday was a PR disaster for the mtn, good thing it's been a good year so far. It was windy, but I gotta say I've never seen a mountain that goes to wind holds like this place.

Bring back the Spring Fling Triple!

[HowieT2]

I think the closure of the VH chair can be put down as 'budget hold". I don't doubt the mechanical issues, but I don't think that, especially given the time if season we're entering, SV will go to heroic measures to reopen this season.

The kids race is a time honored tradition that the kids love, not a big deal to traffic flow that had already ground to a halt.

Sunday was a PR disaster for the mtn, good thing it's been a good year so far. It was windy, but I gotta say I've never seen a mountain that goes to wind holds like this place.

Bring back the Spring Fling Triple!

We've had this wind hold discussion before and my take is that there is no upside for the mtn to want to close lifts. It's not like it saves them any money. So if they put something on wind hold, there is no reason to suspect it is for any purpose other than safety. I was on the 4th chair on the Super Bravo at 8 AM sunday and got 3 rides before it went on wind hold. I can't quantify it, but it was windy as sh-t. On one run we headed for the woods off the bottom of organgrinder and the wind was so strong it nearly stopped us dead in our tracks. But it was fine in the trees.

[win]

This has nothing to do with budgets.

I guess none of you read the signs that were posted at Bravo and the Valley house. They said, "During our weekly inspection, lift maintenance discovered a pattern of concerns with the grips on the Valley House lift and have recommended that we take the lift out of service until a total evaluation has been made. It is unlikely that the flift will operate for the rest of the season." This decision was passed totally on safety considerations. As you know, the VH is one of our oldest lifts and while it has run well up to now and passed inspections, our crew has some concerns about chairs slipping, and they are not able to isolate the issue until they have the time to do a full evaluation which includes among other things a full rope inspection which requires an outside expert. We were only planning to run the VH on the weekends for the rest of the year and in April for the final days of skiing instead of Bravo, but it is unfortunate that we have this problem right now.

In order to keep our Spring Skiing going as long as we can through April we made more snow last week on the Valley Traverse as one exits the Bravo chair on the left, and we believe that this will keep the traverse skiable over to Snowball for the Spring. We can also push up snow from Murphy's where we made quite a bit and where depths now are good.

[shadyjay]

While the wind delays on Sunday were an inconvenience, it did get me up to Castlerock (wanting to avoid the base), and when we got to the Gate House mob, we were in the back and the second Bravo started spinning, we were off! At least with both Gate House and Bravo spinning, lines are more negligible - it seems mobbed at first. Gate House is especially bad since not only is the entire general public trying to get on, but so is ski school and there was quite the line of them as well. Bravo seems to see less ski-schoolers and less families, so that line generally moves quick. C/R line was long, but that's to be expected - no complaints there. V/H would have been nice, but I did recall the sign I saw on Sat about it being down. More and more so do I miss Spring Fling, mainly since it was a quick way to do some quick runs with 'rarely a line. Bringing V/H down to the base adjacent to Bravo would/will help matters especially on those busy weekends. Given its current out of the way location, you're only going to pass it if coming down Mall/Twist, or any Bravo runs down to Coffee Run, and most folk generally head down Gondi anyway to the Bravo. Having 2 side-by-side on that side of the base will be adventageous. I think I can wait.

As far as I could tell, Snowball/Lower Snowball were open both Sat & Sun. Made it over there both days, one day via coming out from Eden and the other day coming down Lwr Snowball to Racer's. Spring Fling was definetely closed on Sunday, not a concern for me since I'm not a huge fan of that run. Moonshine and Twist were a lot more fun anyway.

[ski_resort_observer]

Bring back the Spring Fling Triple!

If memory serves I think the lift was sold to some amusement park in Jersey.

[win]

Maybe, but the Slug at ME was sold to Jay!

[shadyjay]

Maybe, but the Slug at ME was sold to Jay!

I don't know a sole on earth who misses the Slug... I'm not sure what ASC was thinking when they put that thing in.
One of the best moves that Win and gang did was to replace it with the GMX-part deux.
Remember, when the Slug was there, it took longer to reach the bottom of Cliffs than it takes today to travel to the Glen House.
In my opinion, one of the best decisions ever!
And now that I've been to Castlerock, I can finally appreciate why the CR double was replaced with one of the same capacity/speed.
Good choice!

[Tin Woodsman]

I'm pretty sure the Spring Fling triple was sold to an amusement park in PA, not NJ.

As for the Slug, I heard from someone who should know that the thought process was related to wanting to drop people off at the Slide Brook Express instead of "forcing" them to ski down from Glen House.

Anyway, presumably the VH issues can be resolved over the summer then. That would be good news if true. Closing off most/all of Spring Fling and Snowball on a busy March Sunday - not so good.

[007]

Closing off most/all of Spring Fling and Snowball on a busy March Sunday - not so good.

Not to be antagonistic, there were 49 other blue square trails to ski on that day, despite the popularity of those two and there convenience for starting, racing, and finish areas.

[BushMogulMaster]

I'm pretty sure the Spring Fling triple was sold to an amusement park in PA, not NJ.

As for the Slug, I heard from someone who should know that the thought process was related to wanting to drop people off at the Slide Brook Express instead of "forcing" them to ski down from Glen House.

Anyway, presumably the VH issues can be resolved over the summer then. That would be good news if true. Closing off most/all of Spring Fling and Snowball on a busy March Sunday - not so good.

Correct on the Spring Fling Triple. It is currently in operation at Knoebel's Grove Amusement Park, Pennsylvania.

Win -- was the VH haul rope replaced when the new Poma Alpha Series drive was installed? The chairs are replacements, installed in the 80's by Borvig. I can't imagine the grips are failing already??? Sounds more like an aging haul rope. Better for the lift to be down for the season, than to have a catastrophic failure accompanied by potential injury, don't you all agree? But the lift itself is tired. It is due to be replaced.

Without making any judgment of the prior decision to only run VH on a limited basis, I will say this: the worst thing for any kind of lift is to let it sit. Simple as that.

[BushMogulMaster]

And here's a question. I'm not directing this specifically at arc1 (because I think I understand what he was getting at), but in general. Why is it that people automatically assume that any decision made that doesn't suit them simply MUST be for budgetary reasons? I've just never understood that.

Uh oh... Summit's on "windhold." Must be for money reasons. Oh no... the third stair going up to Bravo has a small chunk of ice on it, I guess they didn't want to pay someone to take care of it. Hmmm, Inverness is running awfully slow. Must be to save on the electric bill! Huh, no snowmaking on Brambles tonight. Guess they don't want to pay for it! Looks like they only groomed half of Cliffs. Guess they can't afford an extra hour of snowcat operation.

Not attacking anyone specifically, I just get frustrated as an "industry professional" when the fingers immediately point, and the accusation is immediately "budgetary."


Carry on.