WEATHER

[BushMogulMaster]

EVERY other mountain in the Northeast, including the Catskills, tried their best to run their races this weekend, and waited until the last second if they were FORCED to cancel - and NONE of them that I am referring to have even CLOSE to the open terrain we do. SB called these races off on Monday - they didn't even TRY!

Don't you think that's a bit harsh? You're entitled to your opinion, but let's try to keep it at least respectful.

[sugarboarder]

EVERY other mountain in the Northeast, including the Catskills, tried their best to run their races this weekend, and waited until the last second if they were FORCED to cancel - and NONE of them that I am referring to have even CLOSE to the open terrain we do. SB called these races off on Monday - they didn't even TRY!

Don't you think that's a bit harsh? You're entitled to your opinion, but let's try to keep it at least respectful.

What is disrespectful about that? Those are the facts. It is not an opinion. I am angry about it, as are others. There is more too this as well - which I have not posted. I think it was terribly disrespectful of the mountain, to the USASA racers and directors, to write this race off SIX days ago. I won't even go into what they did to us last year - it was embarrasing to me from the standpoint of wanting my fellow racers to have a great experience on my home mountain.

If they ran it today, instead of "sparse crowds" - they would have had about 70 racers each paying a $90 entry fee to race. It's not like we get to do it for free and therefore need to show some sort of respect in that regard. Believe me, I understand that it is a priviledge to be able to race - but it is alo an income source for the mountain...not only day of race, but possibly in the future from racers who have never been here before and might have a good time.

I realize of course that this weather is BEYOND strange - but the fact remains...they did not even give it a chance. We have wireless timing here, which we used for the race Thursday, so any trail with snow would have been a possibility.

The USASA racers spend a LOT of extra money and time on racing, and use these races to qualify for the Nationals in Tahoe (this year). I will reiterate...FIVE other mountains did everything in their power to run this weekend, right up to the last minute.

Not my opinion; fact..and you are right..I do find it harsh.

[ski_resort_observer]

EVERY other mountain in the Northeast, including the Catskills, tried their best to run their races this weekend, and waited until the last second if they were FORCED to cancel - and NONE of them that I am referring to have even CLOSE to the open terrain we do. SB called these races off on Monday - they didn't even TRY!

Don't you think that's a bit harsh? You're entitled to your opinion, but let's try to keep it at least respectful.

What is disrespectful about that? Those are the facts. It is not an opinion. I am angry about it, as are others. There is more too this as well - which I have not posted. I think it was terribly disrespectful of the mountain, to the USASA racers and directors, to write this race off SIX days ago. I won't even go into what they did to us last year - it was embarrasing to me from the standpoint of wanting my fellow racers to have a great experience on my home mountain.

If they ran it today, instead of "sparse crowds" - they would have had about 70 racers each paying a $90 entry fee to race. It's not like we get to do it for free and therefore need to show some sort of respect in that regard. Believe me, I understand that it is a priviledge to be able to race - but it is alo an income source for the mountain...not only day of race, but possibly in the future from racers who have never been here before and might have a good time.

I realize of course that this weather is BEYOND strange - but the fact remains...they did not even give it a chance. We have wireless timing here, which we used for the race Thursday, so any trail with snow would have been a possibility.

The USASA racers spend a LOT of extra money and time on racing, and use these races to qualify for the Nationals in Tahoe (this year). I will reiterate...FIVE other mountains did everything in their power to run this weekend, right up to the last minute.

Not my opinion; fact..and you are right..I do find it harsh.

You have a right to your opinion and expressing it is one of the great things about having a forum like this. I have to respectfully diagree with you. With racers and family driving from great distances, waiting to the last minute, keeping them hanging on, to cancel, would have been the worst possible thing to do. The Bush made the right call and letting all concerned know early rather than later is always the right call. Today, by 9AM the Bush was down to under 30 trails with high winds predicted later in the day which has happened. I am now at home near the Mad River and the wind is even howling down here.

[BushMogulMaster]

You have a right to your opinion and expressing it is one of the great things about having a forum like this. I have to respectfully diagree with you. With racers and family driving from great distances, waiting to the last minute, keeping them hanging on, to cancel, would have been the worst possible thing to do. The Bush made the right call and letting all concerned know early rather than later is always the right call. Today, by 9AM the Bush was down to under 30 trails with high winds predicted later in the day which has happened. I am now at home near the Mad River and the wind is even howling down here.

Thanks, SRO. That's kind of what I was getting at, just didn't make it as clear!

[walks]

Looked like the river was starting to crest too.

[sugarboarder]

You have a right to your opinion and expressing it is one of the great things about having a forum like this. I have to respectfully diagree with you. With racers and family driving from great distances, waiting to the last minute, keeping them hanging on, to cancel, would have been the worst possible thing to do. The Bush made the right call and letting all concerned know early rather than later is always the right call. Today, by 9AM the Bush was down to under 30 trails with high winds predicted later in the day which has happened. I am now at home near the Mad River and the wind is even howling down here.

Sorry, but there is no "opinion" in what I said - it is all facts. Sugarbush dropped the ball - and they should take their lumps, and try to do it better next time, that's all. This mountain has so many apologists for things that go wrong it is amazing. It's nice to hear those folks that say - "yup, that was the wrong way to do it and we need to fix it", like Win often does. And I absolutely mean no disrespect to Win here - quite the contrary - this can be an opportunity for SB to learn how passionate the USASA racers are about their sport and modify policy accordingly.

Bromley waited until the last possible second to cancel this morning - and that was because they had NO snow (0 trails) - we had snow (27 trails) here for god sake. There were 40 people at Bromley this morning and NOBODY complained, so I have to completely disagree with you that waiting until the last possible monent is "the worst possible thing to do". By far, the large majority of the competitors are up here every weekend already so a canceled event at the last minute is no big deal. We are all dedicated and as I have now repeatedly tried to point out - are all willing to wait until the last minute to try to race. Most of us would drive just about anywhere in the notheast for even the remote possibility of a race. Besides, my point is largely that the race could have been run here no problem. The 'bush made the WRONG call.

Someone above also posted that closing a trail for an event when there is limited terrain is not possible. But as far as I heard today - the USSA mogul comp was held today...so what is the difference between closing a trail for a mogul comp and for a race...answer - no difference. Fact is - the mountain missed out on 50-70 people paying $90 each and contrary to your statement that calling it off early kept people from getting angry - there is plenty of dismay at the event not being held when it could have been. That is a fact by the way, not an opinion - I have talked with a number of people about this.

The "respect" stuff is a bit much. I used no foul language, did not blame any one person or slander/defame anyone, there was no name-calling or the like...if you want to see disrespect look at some of the comments about Timbers first few weeks in another thread in this forum - they just opened, give 'em a break.

Just to further illustrate my points, and why I and others are not happy with the whole situation. The reason given to the USASA series director that the race could not be run was that "the trail with the wiring for timing does not have enough snow on it". Given that SB has a wireless timing system (we used it for the Ski Club race Thursday), that statement holds no water and is a cop out.

I do want to thank Sugarbush, and especially Matt O'Brien, for going beyond the call of duty in setting a course and running a race for the Ski Club Thursday...much appreciated and a great effort Matt!!

[BushMogulMaster]

You have a right to your opinion and expressing it is one of the great things about having a forum like this. I have to respectfully diagree with you. With racers and family driving from great distances, waiting to the last minute, keeping them hanging on, to cancel, would have been the worst possible thing to do. The Bush made the right call and letting all concerned know early rather than later is always the right call. Today, by 9AM the Bush was down to under 30 trails with high winds predicted later in the day which has happened. I am now at home near the Mad River and the wind is even howling down here.

Sorry, but there is no "opinion" in what I said - it is all facts. Sugarbush dropped the ball - and they should take their lumps, and try to do it better next time, that's all. This mountain has so many apologists for things that go wrong it is amazing. It's nice to hear those folks that say - "yup, that was the wrong way to do it and we need to fix it", like Win often does. And I absolutely mean no disrespect to Win here - quite the contrary - this can be an opportunity for SB to learn how passionate the USASA racers are about their sport and modify policy accordingly.

Bromley waited until the last possible second to cancel this morning - and that was because they had NO snow (0 trails) - we had snow (27 trails) here for god sake. There were 40 people at Bromley this morning and NOBODY complained, so I have to completely disagree with you that waiting until the last possible monent is "the worst possible thing to do". By far, the large majority of the competitors are up here every weekend already so a canceled event at the last minute is no big deal. We are all dedicated and as I have now repeatedly tried to point out - are all willing to wait until the last minute to try to race. Most of us would drive just about anywhere in the notheast for even the remote possibility of a race. Besides, my point is largely that the race could have been run here no problem. The 'bush made the WRONG call.

Someone above also posted that closing a trail for an event when there is limited terrain is not possible. But as far as I heard today - the USSA mogul comp was held today...so what is the difference between closing a trail for a mogul comp and for a race...answer - no difference. Fact is - the mountain missed out on 50-70 people paying $90 each and contrary to your statement that calling it off early kept people from getting angry - there is plenty of dismay at the event not being held when it could have been. That is a fact by the way, not an opinion - I have talked with a number of people about this.

The "respect" stuff is a bit much. I used no foul language, did not blame any one person or slander/defame anyone, there was no name-calling or the like...if you want to see disrespect look at some of the comments about Timbers first few weeks in another thread in this forum - they just opened, give 'em a break.

Just to further illustrate my points, and why I and others are not happy with the whole situation. The reason given to the USASA series director that the race could not be run was that "the trail with the wiring for timing does not have enough snow on it". Given that SB has a wireless timing system (we used it for the Ski Club race Thursday), that statement holds no water and is a cop out.

I do want to thank Sugarbush, and especially Matt O'Brien, for going beyond the call of duty in setting a course and running a race for the Ski Club Thursday...much appreciated and a great effort Matt!!

I'll respect your thoughts, since apparently it's not an opinion. But I won't discuss it any further, and I think it should end right here. We're not going to convince you, and you're not going to convince us (or at least me). If you still have a problem, email Win, Hardy (VP Mt. Services), or Dan (Mt. Ellen GM) and take it up with one of them. I can give you any of their email addresses to address the issue (pun intended ) I don't mean to sound nasty, I just think that we're not getting anywhere with this conversation. Ranting about it won't change anything.

[sugarboarder]

I'll respect your thoughts, since apparently it's not an opinion. But I won't discuss it any further, and I think it should end right here. We're not going to convince you, and you're not going to convince us (or at least me). If you still have a problem, email Win, Hardy (VP Mt. Services), or Dan (Mt. Ellen GM) and take it up with one of them. I can give you any of their email addresses to address the issue (pun intended ) I don't mean to sound nasty, I just think that we're not getting anywhere with this conversation. Ranting about it won't change anything.

I respectfully disagree. There shouldn't be any need to convince. I've stated MORE than clearly the situation. Sorry you don't, or won't, understand. Your attitude is unfortunate though - calling this "disrespectful" and that it is just a "rant" and that I "have a problem". Sugarbush has the problem - I am just bringing it to light. Something tells me it's the prevalent MRV anti-snowboard thing...on many levels. This place is SO FAR behind the 8-ball on that it's gone blind.

Thank you for your offer (really) but I'm all set there. I'm know who to get a hold of regarding the situation, and my series director will be doing the exploring on this issue. And au contraire my friend, "ranting" (as you put it - when people don't like a postion being taken, it's so easy to dismiss it as a rant) ...ahem, "discussing" the issue will indeed have an affect. Raises awareness of the situation - clarifies the points in writing - leads to discussion - leads to change if necessary. Otherwise the same problem just keeps happening.

[BushMogulMaster]

I respectfully disagree. There shouldn't be any need to convince. I've stated MORE than clearly the situation. Sorry you don't, or won't, understand. Your attitude is unfortunate though - calling this "disrespectful" and that it is just a "rant" and that I "have a problem". Sugarbush has the problem - I am just bringing it to light. Something tells me it's the prevalent MRV anti-snowboard thing...on many levels. This place is SO FAR behind the 8-ball on that it's gone blind.

Thank you for your offer (really) but I'm all set there. I'm know who to get a hold of regarding the situation, and my series director will be doing the exploring on this issue. And au contraire my friend, "ranting" (as you put it - when people don't like a postion being taken, it's so easy to dismiss it as a rant) ...ahem, "discussing" the issue will indeed have an affect. Raises awareness of the situation - clarifies the points in writing - leads to discussion - leads to change if necessary. Otherwise the same problem just keeps happening.

Okay. I hope you get it resolved so that you're happy with the outcome.

I think you slightly mistook my comments, and I wasn't trying to "dismiss" your position or say that you had a "problem" (that was in reference to the fact that you had an issue that was bothering you... not that you personally had a "problem"). I really do respect what you have to say. I just don't agree, and that's okay. I don't want to cause any hard feelings, and sincerely apologize if I've offended you. I value racing as much as the next person, and I mean that full-heartedly.

Also, correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think that Elbow (the only reasonable trail today for racing) actually qualifies for a USASA race course for pitch and length. I could be wrong, but that's what I've heard. It's completely fine for practice, but not for comp.

[sugarboarder]

I respectfully disagree. There shouldn't be any need to convince. I've stated MORE than clearly the situation. Sorry you don't, or won't, understand. Your attitude is unfortunate though - calling this "disrespectful" and that it is just a "rant" and that I "have a problem". Sugarbush has the problem - I am just bringing it to light. Something tells me it's the prevalent MRV anti-snowboard thing...on many levels. This place is SO FAR behind the 8-ball on that it's gone blind.

Thank you for your offer (really) but I'm all set there. I'm know who to get a hold of regarding the situation, and my series director will be doing the exploring on this issue. And au contraire my friend, "ranting" (as you put it - when people don't like a postion being taken, it's so easy to dismiss it as a rant) ...ahem, "discussing" the issue will indeed have an affect. Raises awareness of the situation - clarifies the points in writing - leads to discussion - leads to change if necessary. Otherwise the same problem just keeps happening.

Okay. I hope you get it resolved so that you're happy with the outcome.

I think you slightly mistook my comments, and I wasn't trying to "dismiss" your position or say that you had a "problem" (that was in reference to the fact that you had an issue that was bothering you... not that you personally had a "problem"). I really do respect what you have to say. I just don't agree, and that's okay. I don't want to cause any hard feelings, and sincerely apologize if I've offended you. I value racing as much as the next person, and I mean that full-heartedly.

Also, correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think that Elbow (the only reasonable trail today for racing) actually qualifies for a USASA race course for pitch and length. I could be wrong, but that's what I've heard. It's completely fine for practice, but not for comp.

Thanks BMM...got it. I'm just passionate about my sports, like we all are if we are posting here - and completely race-crazed! Not to mention race-deprived so far this year. We just have so few races to qualify for Nationals that losing ANY one really can affect things - but there are alot of us in that boat right now.

To me the short version is this - EVERY other area in the northeast (5 of them) tried until the last second to get the races run on ANY trail at ANY cost tis weekend. Sugarbush did not, by even a long shot, and we were one of the few areas that could have found a way to get it done. Add the deceptive "non-reason" that was given to the CVT directors and I think it is clear why people are upset.

Elbow qualifies for USASA races no problem...you should see what we race on sometimes! The course also could have been set on a couple other trails which were not "only avenues" to lifts or bases.

I think it is now as simple as this - things will change or we will go elsewhere. Unfortunately this is two years in a row that there have been issues here. The Northern VT Series raced here last year once, and decided not to return because of what happened. Aparrently SB actually ASKED the Central VT Series to host an even there - so the lack of effort to do so is somewhat mystifying. It may be that an "events" person or persons wanted the event, but a "bean counter" type (don't know what else to call it - sorry, no offense inteded to those who do it) saw the weather, decided to cut staff needs for the weekend (understandable) without an appreciation of the ins and outs of the situation, and the situation developed from there.

[sugarboarder]

Now what was this thread about again? Oh yeah, the WEATHER. Ullr is a FRAUD!!

[BushMogulMaster]

Now what was this thread about again? Oh yeah, the WEATHER. Ullr is a FRAUD!!

At least things are looking up for early week.......

[noski]

Now what was this thread about again? Oh yeah, the WEATHER. Ullr is a FRAUD!!

At least things are looking up for early week.......

Probably had issues with his mother. Who was she anyway? (btw-I can't be held responsible for anything I write after 5pm Monday through Friday)

[Strat]

Now what was this thread about again? Oh yeah, the WEATHER. Ullr is a FRAUD!!

At least things are looking up for early week.......

Probably had issues with his mother. Who was she anyway? (btw-I can't be held responsible for anything I write after 5pm Monday through Friday)

Sif was her name... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sif

[HowieT2]

BTW-I was at a party in NYC last night and spoke to some people whose kids were supposed to race yesterday at Stratton and they couldn't understand why their races weren't called off earlier. They decided not to go before they knew of the mountain's decision.