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  1. #46

    Re: Wow, an in-depth conversation on snowmaking.............

    Quote Originally Posted by ahm
    This I would love to hear, in fact I'll buy the beers. I'd love nothing more than to participate in this discussion. So, just name the place Win.

    Snowmaking is a mixture of art and science. Since the "art" part is a bit more difficult to control, the "science" part becomes the obvious lever to adjust to ensure that the highest quality product is produced in the most efficient and cost effect way--the standard "issue" for all manufacturing facilities. Problem is, most ski areas don't have an engineering group on staff to optimize the snowmaking system like a typical large scale manufacturer does--but a ski area "makes" 1000s of metric tons of "product" each season. By taking a hard look at your "manufacturing" practices, using real data (utilities utilization trend charts (electrical/water), T & RH trend charts, statistical sampling of base depths, etc) I think you could go a long way in making the system "spin like a top". When you get right down to it, snowmaking is "crystal" manufacturing. Problem is, you have "numerous manufacturing facilities" (each gun is in reality its own "crystalizer") opperating differently due to location, wind, and differences in real time water flow. This is why I feel there are some ways to better understand and then optimize the snowmaking system.....................
    Somebody hire this person!!! Their comments on Timbers operation in that thread are just as on target and insightful.
    A dose of reality, backed up with facts...no more double-talk and damage control after the fact.
    Altitude is Everything

  2. #47
    he sounds expensive.

  3. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by random_ski_guy
    he sounds expensive.
    It depends...and I am not even remotely in a position to make this call...but sometimes it is expensive NOT to take what appears to be an expensive step. For example, buliding ClayBrook.
    Altitude is Everything

  4. #49
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    Can someone enlighten me as to what's going on with snowmaking? The web page indicates that the snowmaking footprint hasn't changed in like 72 hours. an unending stream of manmade has apparently been hitting:

    Elbow
    Lower Elbow
    Northstar
    Cruiser
    Straight Shot
    Jester
    Lower Jester
    Allyn's Traverse
    Domino Chute
    Lower Downspout

    I understand that base depths needed to be rebuilt on core trails, but that's all ya got? I suspect that this list doesn't accurately reflect the reality on the ground. With the temps we've seen in the last 36 hours, you'd be able to produce an ass-load of snow, assuming of course that GMP doesn't shut you down. When do we see Snowball/Spring Fling, Hot Shot/Waterfall, Which Way, Cliffs, Inverness, Sleeper, etc..? The world watches and waits....

  5. #50

    Join Date
    Dec 2005
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    I second your thoughts

    If snowmaking has continued on these runs for the period of time that they have been listed as undergoing snowmaking, then base depths should be in pretty good shape for these trails. That said, this should allow the movement of the guns to other areas, where it has been stated that the entire spring fling pod could be blown in in three days. So, glad to see that all that snow has been put in place on those core trails and looking forward to moving the effort to other trails, especially with some of the snow that has fallen recently.

  6. #51
    It's not just a question of whether and where snow is being made, but also a matter of getting out the info. They certainly need to get more info about weekend trail/lift counts onto website. People are/have made their weekend decisions about whether to come up from the flats. I have potentially 20 friends (not all staying w me)coming up for MLK weekend but at least 5 believe the website more than me, despite my having forwarded BushMogulMasters snow measurement photos. They point to trail counts. Many of them would be lessons and rentals as well as passes and food. This is a big weekend, normally, but assumptions about lack of cover caused by months of little snow are influencing those w/o access to this site.

  7. #52

    Which brings up the famous quote....

    Quote Originally Posted by notorious
    at least 5 friends believe the website more than me, despite my having forwarded BushMogulMasters snow measurement photos.
    ....by Ski Yogi Master Knee Deepivata "A fool and his powder are soon parted".

  8. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by Tin Woodsman
    Can someone enlighten me as to what's going on with snowmaking? The web page indicates that the snowmaking footprint hasn't changed in like 72 hours. an unending stream of manmade has apparently been hitting:

    Elbow
    Lower Elbow
    Northstar
    Cruiser
    Straight Shot
    Jester
    Lower Jester
    Allyn's Traverse
    Domino Chute
    Lower Downspout

    I understand that base depths needed to be rebuilt on core trails, but that's all ya got? I suspect that this list doesn't accurately reflect the reality on the ground. With the temps we've seen in the last 36 hours, you'd be able to produce an ass-load of snow, assuming of course that GMP doesn't shut you down. When do we see Snowball/Spring Fling, Hot Shot/Waterfall, Which Way, Cliffs, Inverness, Sleeper, etc..? The world watches and waits....
    The ME trails are accurate. They've been blowing the crap out of them, and after last night, depths are great. I think the next plan will be Which Way, Cliffs, Crackerjack, and some effort starting on Inverness. I can't speak for LP... I just don't know.

    Quote Originally Posted by notorious
    It's not just a question of whether and where snow is being made, but also a matter of getting out the info. They certainly need to get more info about weekend trail/lift counts onto website. People are/have made their weekend decisions about whether to come up from the flats. I have potentially 20 friends (not all staying w me)coming up for MLK weekend but at least 5 believe the website more than me, despite my having forwarded BushMogulMasters snow measurement photos. They point to trail counts. Many of them would be lessons and rentals as well as passes and food. This is a big weekend, normally, but assumptions about lack of cover caused by months of little snow are influencing those w/o access to this site.
    The website is definitely not perfect! I think the reason they aren't pulling ropes on many natural trails is due to the fact that there is no heavy base under the new light, fluffy snow. The powder we just got would ski right off down to the grass, as can be seen on Lower Exterminator and the headwall on Bravo. Another few inches and we should be good to go with some more natural trails. Had we not had the heat/rain the other day, I think SB would be nearly 100% open now. However, even though the terrain is still relatively limited, the skiing is fantastic. Notorious... you're welcome to share my comments with your friends. If they don't believe us both, then they may as well ski somewhere else .

  9. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by notorious
    It's not just a question of whether and where snow is being made, but also a matter of getting out the info. They certainly need to get more info about weekend trail/lift counts onto website. People are/have made their weekend decisions about whether to come up from the flats. I have potentially 20 friends (not all staying w me)coming up for MLK weekend but at least 5 believe the website more than me, despite my having forwarded BushMogulMasters snow measurement photos. They point to trail counts. Many of them would be lessons and rentals as well as passes and food. This is a big weekend, normally, but assumptions about lack of cover caused by months of little snow are influencing those w/o access to this site.
    Agreed, though I'm happy to see that the website reported a robust 15" the last two days. I was expecting a half-assed figure there. I've got 4-5 friends coming up who are SB first-timers. It would be great to be able to show them the variety of terrain that SB is famous for. We're going to have cold weather for at least the next two weeks - leave the damn core trails alone for the moment and get to trail count expansion pronto! You'll be ablr to build base depths after the holiday weekend as the coldest air of the season arrives. Going from a 24" base to a 36" base on Cruiser is a complete and total waste of money at this hour.

  10. #55
    Jester
    Lower Jester
    Allyn's Traverse
    Domino Chute
    Lower Downspout
    Some of the info on South:

    Jester, no.

    Lower Jester, yes, but on the bottom stretch, adjoining Lower Downspout, which is also a yes.



    Domino Chute, no.

    Allyn's Traverse, not sure, as I didn't go that way.

    Add Pushover, Gondolier, Easy Rider, First Time, and the assorted guns around the whole base area. Gotta build back that beginner terrain!

    I didn't look at the website, today, so not sure what they said, when. But the ones where I said no, may have had snowmaking last night, before grooming.
    .
    Two roads diverged in a wood,

    and I- I took the one less traveled by,


    And that has made all the difference.

  11. #56
    Going from a 24" base to a 36" base on Cruiser is a complete and total waste of money at this hour.
    If you read reviews, here, in the last few days, you'll realize Cruiser really needed recovering. That is not to build its depth, but to recover from rain and warm, then cold. I have spoken to nobody who said it didn't need a lot of recovery.

    It skied great, yesterday. Have you heard that for a while? And it was more from the guns than the natural.
    .
    Two roads diverged in a wood,

    and I- I took the one less traveled by,


    And that has made all the difference.

  12. #57

    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Ice Coast
    Posts
    145

    Where, oh where are they going to blow snow.................

    Lostone: hope the guns are cranking. A bit of an interesting note from a friend with a fantastic view of the area from Roxbury gap who claimed no guns were running during the day. So, like TW said, enough snow on the core trails, and time to move, move, move those guns to a new, new location. And to the bush mogul master and the claims of huge base depths on the ME trails......................................he knows all, so I am sure I could just bury my lifelink probe right down to that 8' mark..............................right ?????

  13. #58
    A bit of an interesting note from a friend with a fantastic view of the area from Roxbury gap who claimed no guns were running during the day.
    I was on the mountain. All due respect to your friend, my view was a little better.

    What I said was running, was running.
    .
    Two roads diverged in a wood,

    and I- I took the one less traveled by,


    And that has made all the difference.

  14. #59
    guns are cranking... lost power 10min ago.....very windy!
    "Quietly Heartbroken Tennis Player."

  15. #60

    Re: Where, oh where are they going to blow snow.............

    Quote Originally Posted by ahm
    Lostone: hope the guns are cranking. A bit of an interesting note from a friend with a fantastic view of the area from Roxbury gap who claimed no guns were running during the day. So, like TW said, enough snow on the core trails, and time to move, move, move those guns to a new, new location. And to the bush mogul master and the claims of huge base depths on the ME trails......................................he knows all, so I am sure I could just bury my lifelink probe right down to that 8' mark..............................right ?????
    I believe I said depths are "great" not "huge." There's a big difference.

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