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  1. #1
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    Ongoing Mtn Ops Discussion

    A few observations from the last four days of skiing

    1) Great job by the mtn taking the time to ski pack Spillsville and Black Diamond. This will (already has) pay dividends in the future when the snows come.

    2) IMHO, a little bit of weak sauce on the snowmaking effort Wednesday. Great to see them making snow all the way down to the base on Straight Shot, but the gaps on lower Cruiser and Mainstream were absolutely brutal. At a minimum, there should have been a focus on opening that lower piece of Cruiser just above Times Square so as to provide and alternate route around the narrow ice rink that was Mainstream. Looked like a few more guns were starting up towards the end of the day in that area yesterday, so it looks like someone got the memo. Wish that would have started 10 hours sooner - temps were there.

    3) Otherwise, most of North skied beautifully yesterday, with the exception of Lookin Good, which was Skiin Bad. Pretty sure it wasn't grooomed, to what benefit I don't know.

    4) The aforementioned efforts on Spillsville are beginning to pay dividends with the opening of that trail yesterday. Looks like the grassy Birdland and the upper part of Bravo have been opened to the public today. I like it. The more options, the better, even if coverage is sketchball.

    5) What's next? Got to think Hotshot/Waterfall gets hit once Pushover is done. Then probably Glade or Birdland or Snowball/Spring Fling. My money would be on the latter combo. And at North? Northway then Which Way then Cliffs me thinks. Sorry for those GMVS guys - Inverness might take a while - it's too damn big to make sense to target early.


  2. #2

    Re: Ongoing Mtn Ops Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Tin Woodsman
    A few observations from the last four days of skiing

    1) Great job by the mtn taking the time to ski pack Spillsville and Black Diamond. This will (already has) pay dividends in the future when the snows come.
    I think you mean Bravo. But I agree. Definitely a big help.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tin Woodsman
    2) IMHO, a little bit of weak sauce on the snowmaking effort Wednesday. Great to see them making snow all the way down to the base on Straight Shot, but the gaps on lower Cruiser and Mainstream were absolutely brutal. At a minimum, there should have been a focus on opening that lower piece of Cruiser just above Times Square so as to provide and alternate route around the narrow ice rink that was Mainstream. Looked like a few more guns were starting up towards the end of the day in that area yesterday, so it looks like someone got the memo. Wish that would have started 10 hours sooner - temps were there.
    Some things to keep in mind are pumping/air capacity, placement of guns, etc. It's not as easy as just turning on guns wherever you want to, whenever you want to. I think the effort will be to get the lower portion of Which Way done down to Times Square. I definitely agree, though, that something needs to be done there!

    Quote Originally Posted by Tin Woodsman
    3) Otherwise, most of North skied beautifully yesterday, with the exception of Lookin Good, which was Skiin Bad. Pretty sure it wasn't grooomed, to what benefit I don't know.
    Power tilling isn't always the answer. If the snow depth is sketchy, tilling it will ruin the trail, and likely damage the equipment. Also, tilling it sometimes causes it to ski off much more quickly than leaving it alone. Also, have you ever noticed the frozen cat tracks on the trails? Those are a pain, and are as a result of grooming. Of course, I wasn't skiing it today, so maybe I'm off the mark in this particular case. Just remember that power tilling a trail isn't the ultimate fix for every snow surface problem at a ski area.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tin Woodsman
    4) The aforementioned efforts on Spillsville are beginning to pay dividends with the opening of that trail yesterday. Looks like the grassy Birdland and the upper part of Bravo have been opened to the public today. I like it. The more options, the better, even if coverage is sketchball.
    Yup!

    Quote Originally Posted by Tine Woodsman
    5) What's next? Got to think Hotshot/Waterfall gets hit once Pushover is done. Then probably Glade or Birdland or Snowball/Spring Fling. My money would be on the latter combo. And at North? Northway then Which Way then Cliffs me thinks. Sorry for those GMVS guys - Inverness might take a while - it's too damn big to make sense to target early.
    Yup!

    Just my .02

  3. #3
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    Re: Ongoing Mtn Ops Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by BushMogulMaster

    I think you mean Bravo. But I agree. Definitely a big help.
    Didn't see Bravo, so if they ski packed that as well, kudos. Did see Black Diamond, and though it obviously needs a lot more snow, this effort will help when it comes.

    Some things to keep in mind are pumping/air capacity, placement of guns, etc. It's not as easy as just turning on guns wherever you want to, whenever you want to. I think the effort will be to get the lower portion of Which Way done down to Times Square. I definitely agree, though, that something needs to be done there!
    I get that, which is why I was confused when a few more guns were turned on at the end of the day on that portion of lower Cruiser near Times Sq when it didn't appear that any other guns had been turned off to compensate. That section was downright dangerous and scary. It should be near the top of the list for remedying in the short-term.

    Power tilling isn't always the answer. If the snow depth is sketchy, tilling it will ruin the trail, and likely damage the equipment. Also, tilling it sometimes causes it to ski off much more quickly than leaving it alone. Also, have you ever noticed the frozen cat tracks on the trails? Those are a pain, and are as a result of grooming. Of course, I wasn't skiing it today, so maybe I'm off the mark in this particular case. Just remember that power tilling a trail isn't the ultimate fix for every snow surface problem at a ski area.
    I don't think snow depth was the issue on Lookin Good. They had made a good amount of snow on it and it had great coverage/depth. The issue was that the surface was re-frozen crud. I'm not sure why Lookin Good should have received any different treatment than Rim Run or Elbow, which were both skiing beautifully until the end of the day.

  4. #4

    Re: Ongoing Mtn Ops Discussion

    Makes sense. Like I said, I wasn't there today, so I can't make an informed judgment

  5. #5
    1) You shoulda seen Looking Good today. It really was looking good! The corrective action seems to have been to groom it.

    B) Cruiser and Main Street? Too many people on a too icy trail. On the good side they're working on it. Guns on Cruser and hitting the lower area of Main Street. They just have to overpower the effect of too many people coming down them.

    III) The top of the mountain was skiing really well. Bravo was nice, early. The bail out onto Exterminator... Not so much.

    My second run was Bravo to Exterminator to Cruiser to Main Street. By the time I got onto Northridge (How nice to see Northridge open! ) I couldn't believe how easy Bravo had been.
    .
    Two roads diverged in a wood,

    and I- I took the one less traveled by,


    And that has made all the difference.

  6. #6
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    One more thing I forgot to mention.

    X-Mas day, they had one poor kid in the Glen House serving the many folks who showed up. I know it's tough to find people who will work that day, but that really put the kid in a tough position with the guests. He was pretty much overwhelmed trying to deal with the cash register, grill, and soup/hot food station all by himself, causing a long line even during off-peak periods. And that was before he ran out of hot dogs, chili, and clam chowder before 1:30.

  7. #7

    Any comment on water?

    There have been many discussions on the need for cold temps and the need for compressor capacity. Have we been running dry? (thus limiting snow output)

  8. #8
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    Re: Any comment on water?

    Quote Originally Posted by castlerock
    There have been many discussions on the need for cold temps and the need for compressor capacity. Have we been running dry? (thus limiting snow output)
    given the marginal temps, I doubt they've been running dry. My rudimentary understanding is that when it's warmer, you max out on compressed air as you are trying harder to atomize the flow of water - hence the leased diesel compressors.

  9. #9
    New openings today:
    Pushover > Lower Pushover, and two of the three options from the end, left to Village Chair, including Sugarbush Forest and Sugarbush Run, and right to Overshot and Lower Hot Shot... well actually Overshot isn't marked on the trail report but I don't see how you can get from Lower Pushover to Lower Hot Shot without some slogging through the woods otherwise...

    Lower Paradise... interesting choice. I guess it's been holding snow well, but this is probably aided by the fact that getting there involves a hairy grass and dirt fest on Spillsville, so traffic should stay low...

    Allyn's Traverse rounds it out for the day... shouldn't have a huge impact... people will now be able to get from the bottom of Upper Jester to Lower Jester/Domino Chute/Downspout more quickly, but with the opening of Gatehouse I think we'll see a HUGE reduction in crowding on this upper Super Bravo pod... God I hope so....
    Ithaca is (not) Vermont (but it is gorges)

  10. #10
    Perhaps this is a bit off topic, but it's close enough ...

    I was at ME yesterday and noticed the skier shuttle from the parking lot was missing in action. Not a big deal, but the hike up from the lot loaded with equipment did sour my son's mood a bit. I eventually took pity and took care of his boot bag for him, leaving him with just his skis. Was this a one time deal do to an equipment/staffing problem? Or, is this a regular ocurrance.

    His mood was completely trashed when I mistakenly chose cruiser as our first run of the day at about 10:30. I saw that Northridge was open and wanted to head straight over. Between the noise of the guns, the overhwelming crowd, sections of barely edgable ice and a couple of hard falls, he declared he had had enough after one run. If only we had gone up the summit chair intead. I hear that was much better. At least the lobster bisque bread boal cheered him up a bit. It was really disappointing because he skied (sp?) the bumps really well and I was looking forward to some more bump runs with him.

    I've never skied (sp?) in crowds the like of which we encountered on cruiser. I did not feel like I could make even short predicatble turns without looking uphill first. I hung just behind my son just to create a small amount of space for him. Under such conditions, I would urge management to limit loading to every other chair. I'd rather wait in line a few minutes than ski in a crowd.

    I won't be able to make it up today. Hopefully my in-laws won't be offended if I take a day or two over the weekend.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by tymoguls
    Perhaps this is a bit off topic, but it's close enough ...

    I was at ME yesterday and noticed the skier shuttle from the parking lot was missing in action. Not a big deal, but the hike up from the lot loaded with equipment did sour my son's mood a bit. I eventually took pity and took care of his boot bag for him, leaving him with just his skis. Was this a one time deal do to an equipment/staffing problem? Or, is this a regular ocurrance.
    Not sure how often that happens, but one thing I thought of when I was there the other day was that it would be a worthwhile investment for SB to construct a wooden stairway between the top few levels of the parking lot. You've got one from the handicapped/special parking area to the temporary unloading area up top. Why not add one for people trekking from further down? The walk up the roadways can be muddy, difficult, and dangerous with traffic. A walkway/stariway built to connect the middle of those lots would not only be functionally usefull, but a lot more asthaethically pleasing as well.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Lostone
    1) You shoulda seen Looking Good today. It really was looking good! The corrective action seems to have been to groom it.
    Ditto. I skied it several times. Conditions @ ME were much better today than earlier in the week.
    "Quietly Heartbroken Tennis Player."

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Tin Woodsman
    Quote Originally Posted by tymoguls
    Perhaps this is a bit off topic, but it's close enough ...

    I was at ME yesterday and noticed the skier shuttle from the parking lot was missing in action. Not a big deal, but the hike up from the lot loaded with equipment did sour my son's mood a bit. I eventually took pity and took care of his boot bag for him, leaving him with just his skis. Was this a one time deal do to an equipment/staffing problem? Or, is this a regular ocurrance.
    Not sure how often that happens, but one thing I thought of when I was there the other day was that it would be a worthwhile investment for SB to construct a wooden stairway between the top few levels of the parking lot. You've got one from the handicapped/special parking area to the temporary unloading area up top. Why not add one for people trekking from further down? The walk up the roadways can be muddy, difficult, and dangerous with traffic. A walkway/stariway built to connect the middle of those lots would not only be functionally usefull, but a lot more asthaethically pleasing as well.
    Boy, we really know how to spend money. We should all be in congress doling out earmarks. Tin, its a very nice idea, but highly unlikely to happen anytime soon given all the other priorities. Perhaps a staircase for the first two parking wrungs (perhaps that is all you were thinking off) could be done, but after that I'd rather have more snow guns....

  14. #14
    Hmmmm,

    Back in the day, with the kids, I would park up top at North, unload kids and gear, then move the car down to a parking spot, and then walk up to the lodge.

    Mike

  15. #15
    How about a parking lot lift like they have @ the Canyons
    "Quietly Heartbroken Tennis Player."

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