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  1. #1

    Join Date
    Dec 2005
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    In the woods of Mad River Valley
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    584

    Stein's....Good and Bad

    It was great to see us building spring depths on Steins this weekend. Good snow to ski on especially this morning. But I just don't know how they can blow wet, cake your goggles snow, when it is 5 degrees. A more adjustments would have been nice.

    Glad they allowed us to hike to Castlerock. Now hopefully we get new snow so that the chair can run.

    Off to do my snow dance.

  2. #2
    Agreed. I hate to say it, but I've literally never seen worse snowmaking than at Sugarbush.

  3. #3

    Join Date
    Mar 2006
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    warren
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    1,116
    Well guys, I skied it multiples times and didn't get wet. Arc1, I couldn't disagree with you more. A few of the surface guns at the top skier's left were wet for a brief period early Sunday morning until the guys made their "gun runs" and adjusted the air. You are in the minority opinion on this one. There were three great days on Stein's over the holdiay week, and it was still great today.

    FIngers crssed Tree that tonight with bring in enough to spin the lift at CR!

  4. #4

    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Ridgefield, CT
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    49

    Stein's....Good and Bad

    Agree with you Win. I did multiple laps on Stein's each day over the long weekend and it was amazing snow. It was still awesome by the end of Monday.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by win View Post
    Well guys, I skied it multiples times and didn't get wet. Arc1, I couldn't disagree with you more. A few of the surface guns at the top skier's left were wet for a brief period early Sunday morning until the guys made their "gun runs" and adjusted the air. You are in the minority opinion on this one. There were three great days on Stein's over the holdiay week, and it was still great today.

    FIngers crssed Tree that tonight with bring in enough to spin the lift at CR!
    Fair enough, I'm glad they got it fixed. I skied it early twice and was blind after the first 2 turns. I didn't even know it was possible to blow wet snow at those temps. Gotta say though Win, I am not at all a minority regarding the snowmaking on the hill, by a long shot. The quality is often excellent, but there are far too many misses. I understand the limitations we have and the economic reality you face. I'm really glad you are focused on sustaining and improving this place. However, in comparison to any other resort even remotely 'like' us, we are way, way behind on the snowmaking front, in quality and quantity.
    Please note my liberal use of 'we', I'm a believer.

  6. #6

    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    in the troughs and between the trees
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    29
    I believe arc1 is right on with his comment here.

  7. #7

    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Fairfield County, CT
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    40
    Quote Originally Posted by Chewbarka View Post
    I believe arc1 is right on with his comment here.
    Regardless of who is right about "our" snowmaking quality (perhaps the truth lies somewhere in the middle), I think "we" are extraordinarily lucky to have an owner who comes on here and discusses tough issues. Time and again he has engaged constructively and openly with various critics (constructive and otherwise) and regardless of differences of opinion, I think we can be pretty darn sure he "gets" it and is doing absolutely the best he can. This is very rare either in ski area operation or, really, in any walk of life, and we are very fortunate.

    Now if the skies would just unload on us and give us the March we deserve!

    Rope

  8. #8
    OMG will the snowmaking debate never end this year. 'nothing like a nasty thaw and month long snow drought to bring out the worst in all of us.
    looks like its snowing on the webcam. any local reports.

  9. #9

    Join Date
    Mar 2006
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    warren
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    I will let some of the snowmakers chime inwho watch this blog. Snowmaking isn't as simple as turning on a switch. You have to constantly watch the air/water ratio and this is done by being out there. Temperatures can moderate quickly and as temps this will require more air or less water and one has to get up on the hill to do this. We always try to maximize the water we are using, and if we push the llimit too far it can get wetter. Sometimes we actually want to put down wetter snow such as on Inverness for racing or to get a base initially. That said, at times guns will get wetter than what is wanted and when that happens it needs to be corrected by getting a snowmaker up on the hill in order to make an adjustment. I will say that I have been extremely pleased with the snowmaking team and after 78 days on the hill, I have skied in everything they have made and with only a few minor exceptions I have been pleased with the quality and the quantity of what has been made. Even though we have more natural snow this year, we have also blown more snow and are only winding down this week after beginning in the first few days of November. Green Mountain Power likes us!


  10. #10

    Stein's....Good and Bad

    While we're on the subject of snowmaking... I was wondering what happened to the high efficiency guns. I haven't seen these since the beginning of the season.
    Perhaps I've just been in the wrong places.

  11. #11
    gostan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    West Of Boston
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    363
    Quote Originally Posted by Nick Danger View Post
    While we're on the subject of snowmaking... I was wondering what happened to the high efficiency guns. I haven't seen these since the beginning of the season.
    Perhaps I've just been in the wrong places.
    I saw the high efficiency guns puttogreat use on Ripcord one Sunday after the thaw/huge rain event. The snow makers used the tower guns on the 1/2 of Ripcord abutting Paradise area and then filled in the gaps and other 1/2 of trail by stretching out the hoses and moving the guns out further from the side to blow on the middle and far endon Ripcord. The snow was really good that day. Although the several skiers who skied over the hoses were not too helpful. I will say that the snow makers really hadtobust their chops to move those lowto the ground ultra heavy hi efficiency guns. I thought that this was a well thought out use of all resources.
    Stan

    "There ain't no such thing as a sanity clause"

  12. #12
    [QUOTE=arc1;117898]Fair enough, I'm glad they got it fixed. I skied it early twice and was blind after the first 2 turns. I didn't even know it was possible to blow wet snow at those temps. Gotta say though Win, I am not at all a minority regarding the snowmaking on the hill, by a long shot. The quality is often excellent, but there are far too many misses. I understand the limitations we have and the economic reality you face. I'm really glad you are focused on sustaining and improving this place. However, in comparison to any other resort even remotely 'like' us, we are way, way behind on the snowmaking front, in quality and quantity.
    Please note my liberal use of 'we', I'm a be snow the Mtn has been blowing.

    Arc1 - maybe I don't ski enough other areas to make an honest assessment, but WTF are you talking about??? Given the shit weather we had in January, I have no complaints with the snow the Mtn has been blowing. We went from complete bullet proof (just short of a complete washout) after the massive rain storm to really nice PP on most of the main trails - this all happened in 1 week. Not sure what your expectations are after weather like this, but I honestly do not have any complaints and was impressed with the speed of recovery that took place. Hats off to the snow makers,... hopefully you get some help from mother nature this weekend!
    Last edited by djd66; 02-20-2013 at 08:54 PM.

  13. #13
    Thanks to those who have enjoyed the snow this year and those who appreciate what goes into putting out a good product. I'll be sure to pass along some of the comments here with my fellow co-workers. It's not always the easiest job in the world (take Sunday/Sunday night, for example, with winds up to 60-70mph), but watching a trail go from a post-thaw rock solid surface with rocks showing, to packed powder is almost as rewarding as watching a trail go from bare grass to a mid-November skiable surface. The fact that we have made every deadline that was laid before us this season is also pretty cool (opening the weekend before Thanskgiving with top-to-bottom, opening Gate House in early Dec, etc etc). It's not always easy with the challenges that Mother Nature throws at us. And she has thrown us a couple of curveballs this season.

    Win hit on the key snowmaking issues in his earlier posts here. Temperatures can fluctuate. We go on our gun runs and check the snow quality each time to make sure that nothing is too wet. In some cases, we want it wet. Take Snowball/Fling, for example. Those are two of our core "spring" trails. There are other issues that can occur with the guns, such as the air hoses freezing up. If that happens, then the water can't get that critical air mixture and the end result can be straight rain. Other issues can be a gun getting knocked over by a skier and it not being repositioned correctly. Since it can be an hour or more between gun runs (depending on our other pending tasks), there could be periods where guns are wetter than they should be.

    Those high efficiency guns are indeed a challenge to move, and the snow they put out is a lot more dense than what comes out of our other guns. The benefit of them is that they use very little air, which can be crucial, especially early season. We try to keep them positioned on trails/areas that are more flat so that positioning/moving them is easier. They got a lot of use in the base area, in addition to areas such as around Allyn's Traverse, Heaven's Gate, and on Easy Rider/First Time. In the past few weeks, we've only used one or two of them, since we are out of those areas.

    As I type this, it is dumping outside. There was quite a bit of new natural snow out there today and between what's falling right now and what is being made, we should be looking really really good. Continued cooperation from above will be key to what happens in the next 1-2 months.

    See you all out there!
    Last edited by shadyjay; 02-20-2013 at 10:24 PM.

  14. #14
    Hawk's Avatar
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    Oct 2007
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    Quote Originally Posted by HowieT2 View Post
    OMG will the snowmaking debate never end this year. 'nothing like a nasty thaw and month long snow drought to bring out the worst in all of us.
    looks like its snowing on the webcam. any local reports.
    HA!!!! Yes Howie, the debate is always relivant and again I will say it's all perspective. As far as the Bush goes the Snow making was pretty good this year. They did make a few mistakes but overall the quantity was good and the quality was very good at times. But if you compare them to the best snow operations, well lets just say it like comparing a Pro team to a College team. We just don't have the infrastruture, dollars and ability to produce that kind of product. It is snowing again. I will be up for the first time in 3 weeks. Got stung on my west trip but enjoyed the people and the beautiful location. Looking forward to getting out. See you soon.
    Trouble with you is the trouble with me,
    Got two good eyes but we still donít see!

  15. #15

    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Fairfield County, CT
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    40
    Quote Originally Posted by Hawk View Post
    ... Got stung on my west trip but enjoyed the people and the beautiful location. ...
    Hi Hawk

    What does "got stung" mean?

    Isn't skiing out west always perfect?

    Rope

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