Tin Woodsman wrote:

It think that's a great idea, but I'd suggest we start it as a thread in the General MRV discussion to guage the interest before expanding it into a sub-forum.

....sounds like a good start.

smootharc wrote:

skibum1321 wrote: A program like what MRG has with Jay Appleton to maintain the woods would be awesome. Give someone a season pass to run it and then give vouchers for day tix to any volunteers. I love going to the Mad River ones a couple times a year. It really helps you learn about the mountain by trudging around the woods before the snow falls. There are a few places at the glen where I look and say.....that would be a superb glade, but the nicely spaced, mature, and looking to my untrained eyes healthy trees have a bunch of little sprite trees clogging up the lines. I'm thinking....a few hours and a lopper and that whole zone is a great glade. One easily and publicly viewable one is about 1/4 of the way up the single off to the right and looking back down. It's a small below a green dot traverse (Easy Way, I think) trail and the bottom would feed into, again I think, the edge of Waterfall. Anyways, despite MRG's glade reputation, and their necessary and industry leading tree conservation work, it does seem like there's some pretty nice stuff just kind of sitting there that could be developed that might not compromise forest health. Thoughts from someone with more understanding than me would be appreciated.

I think a big reason they don't do more is that they only have a limited amount of time and resources to do the trailwork. They only have about 6 trail days per year so doing more might be tough. There were some new ones developed this year too though...

skibum1321 wrote:

smootharc wrote: skibum1321 wrote: A program like what MRG has with Jay Appleton to maintain the woods would be awesome. Give someone a season pass to run it and then give vouchers for day tix to any volunteers. I love going to the Mad River ones a couple times a year. It really helps you learn about the mountain by trudging around the woods before the snow falls. There are a few places at the glen where I look and say.....that would be a superb glade, but the nicely spaced, mature, and looking to my untrained eyes healthy trees have a bunch of little sprite trees clogging up the lines. I'm thinking....a few hours and a lopper and that whole zone is a great glade. One easily and publicly viewable one is about 1/4 of the way up the single off to the right and looking back down. It's a small below a green dot traverse (Easy Way, I think) trail and the bottom would feed into, again I think, the edge of Waterfall. Anyways, despite MRG's glade reputation, and their necessary and industry leading tree conservation work, it does seem like there's some pretty nice stuff just kind of sitting there that could be developed that might not compromise forest health. Thoughts from someone with more understanding than me would be appreciated. I think a big reason they don't do more is that they only have a limited amount of time and resources to do the trailwork. They only have about 6 trail days per year so doing more might be tough. There were some new ones developed this year too though...

I think the highly visible nature of those trees is a big reason why they haven't been cleared out yet. I think the crews prefer to work in more out of the way locales.

Question was what do you recommend to Summit ventures as a business plan, not what sort of fantasy you 'd like to see realized. My advice: go the other way. You know you can't get permission to build anything (12 years for the pond?), so your plan can't be a copy of Stowe/Killington/Okemo/Stratton. Can't beat the destination resorts at their own game. They've got deep pockets and business-friendly zoning.

In Vermont there are people who easily drive 20, 30, 50 miles to go skiing for the day. Out of all the families who live within 50 miles of the bush, how many are skier/riders? Lots. Burlington area? Tons.

Compete on price and attract as many day skiers as you can. Make it attractive for them by offering an obvious lift ticket bargain. Make them feel comfortable to hang around in a beefed-up base lodge that offers a variety of decent, healthy and reasonably-priced food. Don't make them feel abused at the cash registers. Believe me, they feel that way now.

Invest some real marketing money to get these day-trippers to switch to the bush, and watch your numbers soar. Those who come from afar on weekends will still come. Make the place an attractive day/evening destination as opposed to a weekend destination resort.

All the trends in North America in the last 10 years have pointed towards more 'luxury', and I think we're getting near an inflection point. From coast to coast, attracting the upper-end buyer/visitor has been the game. Everbody's doing it. For gosh sakes, even Volkswagen tries to sell upper-end cars.

Again, purely from a business perspective, it's time to fill those empty chairs. Do it with the large number of customers you actually can get, as opposed to those you dream about. The competitive advantage of Sugarbush? it's the terrain, stupid. Play to that strength. The destination resort idea is a dream. You can't build what's needed to really win over that crowd.

I don't think some of the ideas were fantasy at all - such as the woods maintenance ala MRG. More busses running through Slidebrook is absolutely viable too.

I have been bringing group of advanced skiers every year for about 8 years. We could go anywhere in VT, ME etc. if we wanted to. We have kept coming back for the diversity and challenging skiing of the MRV. We ski at a minimum 3 days and ski MR/Sugar/ME depending on snow conditions and crowds. The area provides 3 unique moutains which keep us more than occupied for three days. The lodging is great for a group of guys, but if you were catering to families, etc. it could be improved. I would like to see the following... Upgrade to the North Lynx Chair, almost got stuck on that one trying to get an extra run, old and freezing. As with other posts, continue to open up more tree runs. Expecially above Inverness, b/c I could really put the ski the valley pass to work and not worry about parking at MR thanks to Strat's Maps -

Without rambling, the reason we come is for the challenge and diversity of skiing for longer than a day trip - keep expanding this and we won't ever go anywhere else.

Quote:

9) Bike path paved from Waitsfield to Warren then up Access RD along the river (a lot less pitch and more beautiful) to South then across to Sugarbush and back to town. With a loop up to Mad River.

The Mad River Path already covers quite a bit of this...but to pave it would be scary...ala Stowe. The Kingsbury Bridge section needs to attach to the northern sections, but there are land owner/access issues. From the Greenway going south...same thing...landowners along the river aren't psyched about people trekking thru their property...but with enough community pressure, the MRPA could get the trails connected.

I'd like to see more summer/year round operations - a larger outdoor pool and recreation center at South would combine with the revitalized tennis program Mike has going at SHARC and help bring in more buyers for the new lodging, etc. Make the golf course more accessible for locals (the price went way up in the last few seasons) during slow times. Ditto on growing the day skier base - areas out west have great buddy pass programs that lower the seasons pass rate and increase skier days - time to get creative!

I know this is incredibly trivial! But a garbage can at the top of lifts would be great...that way I wouldnt have to hold the empty water bottle or coffee cup until I get to the bottom...Again I know it is trivial but it is also very easy to do

mikec13 wrote:

I know this is incredibly trivial! But a garbage can at the top of lifts would be great...that way I wouldnt have to hold the empty water bottle or coffee cup until I get to the bottom...Again I know it is trivial but it is also very easy to do

If I'm not mistaken they do usually have those in the lift shacks... of course this would usually require you to take off your implement of snow slidage, but if you can get someone's attention in there it's probably doable without de-plankerizing...

Strat wrote:

....it's probably doable without de-plankerizing...

.....de-plankerizing. A cousin to de-plane-ing....

smootharc wrote:

Strat wrote: ....it's probably doable without de-plankerizing... .....de-plankerizing. A cousin to de-plane-ing....

Haha, I've always thought that can't really be a word...