It's definitely dangerous out there. There's never any shame in doing 55 (or even 45) if conditions warrant it, and playing it safe is always a good plan. It does make you wonder if those involved in many of the rollovers were in sedans rather than SUV's if they would've experienced the same thing (as a result of less overconfidence more than different vehicle shape/center of mass)...

I don't know. I think sometimes the people who drive too slow, you know like the they're acting like the Grand Marshall at the Rose Bowl Parade can cause just as many accidents because someone driving at the speed limit or just below might come up on them a bit quicker then they expected and have to apply the breaks a bit more then necessary. I mean 55 is OK, but when you start looking at 45 and 35 then you're gonna cause just as much harm unless we're talking white knuckle white out conditions or any other serious dumpings. Personally I think that if they were in a sedan I'll bet there would be the same number of accidents, just less rollovers. The high center of gravity is a beotch when cutting hard on the wheel. I know plenty of people that regardless of what kind of vehicle they're in they still drive like A-holes.

MntMan4Bush wrote:

I know plenty of people that regardless of what kind of vehicle they're in they still drive like A-holes.

Amen to that.

Two words: Snow tires. More words:
Typical stock 'all-season' tires too often give false sense of security even though they are frequently way too much of a compromise in terms of design, materials (esp. rubber compounds) and performance when itmatters most.

Relying on All-seasons is generally OK for the bulk of the weather the flatlands receive, but a different story for those who often find themselves North of MA.

As with skking it's not just having the right equipment (though that helps), it's also about having the requisite experience/patience/skill.

boze wrote:

Two words: Snow tires.

IT'S ALL ABOUT THE TIRES Well sort of, experience is a major part of it also.
Most "all season" radials or snows that most cars come with aren't worth s##t in freezing rain, or a quick snow blitz that we see on 89.

Studded snows (all four) or blizzacks are mandatory for any car/truck/suv in my fleet.

You can hear my son's studded truck coming 1/4 a mile away, but you can't put that s10 into a skid if you wanted to (believe me, I tried)

My Handle says it all. I drive 450 miles every weekend for the benefit of skiing our fabulous mountains.

Lets face it, If it's raining in CT, snowing in the MRV, it's going to suck somewhere in between. Good tires are a excellent investment.

I'd definitely pass on getting true snow tires because they all have crappy speed ratings. Not to say I wouldn't consider a winter performance tire, if I needed new tires but in reality all season radials get the job done. I drive 662 miles every weekend and they have never failed me (knock on wood). This includes a 12 hour trip in a blizzard with major accumulation on the roads.

Where and when were these cars flipped over because I didn't see any? I got on at I-89 exit 3 at about 6:00pm, and the roads seemed fine. I was actually making great time (as usual), until I hit the traffic jam.

Snow tires have come a long way in the 25+ years I've been buying tires for my cars. For straight-line performance nearly any all-season tire in decent shape will do OK in light to moderate snow. It's the turning-at-speed and stopping performance that separate the Winter ties from the all seasons - as well as deep snow traction ie 6"+. No comparison in my personal experience, and that includes several popular all season's...not to mention the independent tests run by the typical auto-enthusiast and consumer product 'zines.

For the past 5 years I've gone for 'performance' snow tires ie H- or V-rated for my sedan. They are a few more bucks to be sure but you get much better dry pavement handling. For me, this is critical as my driving habits do not readily tolerate any 'sway' or 'mushiness' which is typical of regular snow tires. This is due to the softer rubber compounds used to keep the tire more pliable/'sticky' in the colder temps; in snow tires, this compond is often also mixed with silica for extra traction. With performance snows , the sidewalls often get extra reinforcement to offset the affect of the softer rubber. The two models now on my cars are below. I've found the H-rated (130 mph) Dunlop SP Winter Sport 3D to handle 90% as well as the performance summer tires I have on my '07 Acura TL-S...and those summer tires are nothing short of amazing. For our Pacifica, I use a Q-rated (99mph) Bridgestone's Blizzak DM-Z3, since the family AWD Pacifica is not (often) being driven harder than 75mph. Even though these are Q-rated, they easily out-perform the stock Michellin all seasons it came with regardless of whether the roads are wet, dry or snow-covered. And treadwear on both seems to be decent after 3-4k miles on each set (their softer rubber wears fatster)

Ok, so that's a lot about tires. Let's just say I thoroughly research the more important purchases we make - and tires on the cars my kids are driven in easliy qualify for that extra effort.

Bah....... Our 2004 Acura TLS has some serious racing slicks. I'm talking baloney skin treads that rip asphalt and leave cops stranded at the lights choking on donut crumbs.......

Seriously though the performance tires we have on our TLS have handled pretty well even in the snow. I think prior to our purchase of a Jeep we got it up the Roxbury Gap Road all but twice and it had more to do with bottoming out in spring mud ruts. (not a lot of clearance let me tell you.). I think snow tires make a large difference and certainly make things easier, but a good set of all seasons can get you through some tough spots. I also had a long drive last season (8 hours from Boston) with some white knuckle areas and after the traffic cleared I was able to motor along at about 50-55 in the fast lane with no issues even though it was still dumping (On my 4 wheel drive Jeep with nice all seasons). It's kind of like sneaking up on a lion. No sudden moves.

I think what happened to a lot of people on Saturday was that the roads visually appeared fine and then out of no where they slicked up so no one was suspecting a rough ride and wasn't driving as cautiously as they otherwise might have had they known. I don't have a lot of experience with snow tires, but apart from a set of chains I'm not sure much helps you against black ice.

madhavok wrote:

I'd definitely pass on getting true snow tires because they all have crappy speed ratings.

That's why you need summer tires and winter tires. summer=performance, winter=traction to feed the addiction
My blizzaks all have Q or R ratings. 100mph is far faster than I intend to drive.

boze wrote:

Snow tires have come a long way in the 25+ years I've been buying tires for my cars. For straight-line performance nearly any all-season tire in decent shape will do OK in light to moderate snow. It's the turning-at-speed and stopping performance that separate the Winter ties from the all seasons Let's just say I thoroughly research the more important purchases we make - and tires on the cars my kids are driven in easliy qualify for that extra effort.

I like the way you think The only thing is now I have two kids driving also, so that makes four sets of killer tires. I have this foolish idea that my kids should have tires at least as good as mine. $$$$

Have to agree with Boze and WSB here - it makes a huge difference with dedicated snow tires. Blizzacks or those Dunlops are quite a road handling tire set on dry roads as well. And you do pay for that. Blizzacks do wear much faster, never get more than 30K out of them, while the Gilslaveds wear better, they are louder, and don't handle quite as well.

Granted these are on a Saab 900, but with any of the above I have never been turned back on Rox Gap in 20 years I have been driving it.

All that said, a very good driver can make it work with all seasons on paved roads. Nothing trumps a great driver.

I got an MDX with Michelins, and my wife actually prefers the 900 in snow, although you better be good staying on top of ruts on Carrie Howe or Rox/Gap. Gets the adrelaline going fo the the trees too!

As long as you have two sets of wheels, it is a matter of $40 and 15 minutes at the local garage to switch off on Nov and April.
The gripiest tires I have ever had were those Halkepalitas ( Nokia) with studs! Holy cow. But you needed headphones on 495/89 at even 65 MPH. Nothing could stop them, epsecially on a Saab 9000 standard shift.

Where do you guys get your tires? I sometimes use Tire Rack, other times, find them on craigslist/Want Ad with 3-5K on them for 1/2 price.

Last season my 07 TLS could not even make it up the road into the Snowcreek parking lot with an inch or two of new snow...nominal space to make a 'running start', and all the usual tricks culed from 30 yrs New England winter driving proved ineffective eg low gear, zig-zag turns, etc.

Anyway, I use TireRack . com for pricing, then beat up the local Town Fair Tire folks using that knowledge. I usually call a Town Fair Tire shop that's located in a town that's a bit off-the-beaten-path as they often offer you the best deal soonest (saves time & effort). I live in Southern Fairfield County and folks charge accordingly higher prices. Savings tend to be 30-40 / tire so it adds up esp when buying multiple sets.

Love that line, MM4B, " ...kind of like sneaking up on a lion. No sudden moves."

Let's hope the upcoming precip gets & stays frozen - - driving conditions could be real dicey come Fri.

Windshield Ski Bum wrote:

boze wrote: Two words: Snow tires. IT'S ALL ABOUT THE TIRES Well sort of, experience is a major part of it also. Most "all season" radials or snows that most cars come with aren't worth s##t in freezing rain, or a quick snow blitz that we see on 89. Studded snows (all four) or blizzacks are mandatory for any car/truck/suv in my fleet. You can hear my son's studded truck coming 1/4 a mile away, but you can't put that s10 into a skid if you wanted to (believe me, I tried) My Handle says it all. I drive 450 miles every weekend for the benefit of skiing our fabulous mountains. Lets face it, If it's raining in CT, snowing in the MRV, it's going to suck somewhere in between. Good tires are a excellent investment.

You are absolutely correct. I recall reading that front wheel drive with snow tires is better for winter driving than 4WD w/ all seasons and my experience w/ Blizzaks confirms that theory. Im wondering about studded snows; supposedly they are great with snow packed roads, but are bad on ice/wet, etc. because the studs minimize the tires ground contact--is that right?

aejkb wrote:

Windshield Ski Bum wrote: boze wrote: Two words: Snow tires. IT'S ALL ABOUT THE TIRES Well sort of, experience is a major part of it also. Most "all season" radials or snows that most cars come with aren't worth s##t in freezing rain, or a quick snow blitz that we see on 89. Studded snows (all four) or blizzacks are mandatory for any car/truck/suv in my fleet. You can hear my son's studded truck coming 1/4 a mile away, but you can't put that s10 into a skid if you wanted to (believe me, I tried) My Handle says it all. I drive 450 miles every weekend for the benefit of skiing our fabulous mountains. Lets face it, If it's raining in CT, snowing in the MRV, it's going to suck somewhere in between. Good tires are a excellent investment. You are absolutely correct. I recall reading that front wheel drive with snow tires is better for winter driving than 4WD w/ all seasons and my experience w/ Blizzaks confirms that theory. Im wondering about studded snows; supposedly they are great with snow packed roads, but are bad on ice/wet, etc. because the studs minimize the tires ground contact--is that right?

My experience has been really good with studded snows. They grip nicely on ice and snow of all variations, and with 4wd it feels like you can climb walls. I would think that they would grip better on ice than just a straight now tire (but not as well as chains). Not sure about wet/clear pavement other than wearing them down quicker. Oh and the humm they make on dry pavement does take some getting used to.

jkvt

I saw 3 cars off the road on 89 South today between exit 8 and 9. Two SUV's and one pick up truck. As mentioned before if people would just slow down in the snow a lot of it would be prevented.