Bag Storage in the GH Lodge

[MntMan4Bush]

I can't remember if I've ever been to Ragged. I've certainly seen plenty of lodges that have qualities I've liked and would like to have SB emulate, but they're coming aournd. In time we'll get there. I guess it's a growing process.

TW - Nice one. I think that space is not employee space though, but actual changing rooms with closing doors so you can toss on your long johns or something without giving everyone a free show. (For the record I always used to tip for a show). I usually just grab my stuff and stand next to the wall by the shop and switch boots and stuff. I don't like going in there because I have Agoraphobia (fear of wide open spaces :P ). In any case I think before it didn't seem like we needed a bigger room because evryone, myself included, would just change up stairs and leave my stuff under a table or against the wall. There was always plenty of room to change and at the end of the day I could grab a beer and sit there and take my boots off. Now we have eneryone cramming into the same space at the same times of day. Last weekend I just grabbed my boots and headed over to timbers and took them off at my table. Not ideal, but I had 12 less elbows and errant boots to the head. It almost seems though like the entire wall of the building for the bottom floor needs to come out about 30 feet to add room for changing and CR Pub. Throw a deck on top, wheel out a mini bar on Saturdays fire up the heat lanterns and crank the jams up.

[Lostone]

Speaking of the latter, whatever that employee only room is in between the Guest Services desk and the boot changing room - it should have a half life not unlike a rare isotope of Plutonium and be folded into the bag/boot changing area.

Not sure what room you are referring to. Are you referring to the room behind the desk? That is the Guest Services office. Trust me. It is not a spacious area, and is necessary.

If you are referring to another room, I'd like to know where. There is only a wall between the storage room and the Guest Services desk.

Actually, the best solution for the storage area is not to change there. Change in the cafeteria, and drop your bags in the storage area before you head out. It works. 8)

[MntMan4Bush]

The space I was referring to was not the guest services office, but aren't there also several rooms along that wall with doors where people can change or have I been too hung over every morning and totally misinterpretted what I saw? Bear in mind that is always a possibility.

I've tried the caf change idea before and it does work depending on the time of day it's done. I guess the point though is if you're going to have a changing area what's the point if it's not big enough and every one needs to change elsewhere. Might as well just put cubbies along the wall and have it be an extension of the CR Pub.

Of course I've gotten off track a bit talking just about teh changing area. The point of the thread I think was to rate the new SB changes and I still think that overall it is pretty good and looks like it will only get beter. We just need to keep encouraging the changes that take place and making recommendations for changes to improve.

[Tin Woodsman]

Speaking of the latter, whatever that employee only room is in between the Guest Services desk and the boot changing room - it should have a half life not unlike a rare isotope of Plutonium and be folded into the bag/boot changing area.

Not sure what room you are referring to. Are you referring to the room behind the desk? That is the Guest Services office. Trust me. It is not a spacious area, and is necessary.

If you are referring to another room, I'd like to know where. There is only a wall between the storage room and the Guest Services desk.

Actually, the best solution for the storage area is not to change there. Change in the cafeteria, and drop your bags in the storage area before you head out. It works. 8)

Jim -

When you walk into the changing room from the Information Desk (i.e coming from the CR Pub direction), you've got a wall with boot heaters on it to your right. The majority of the troom unfolds to your left. If you keep walking straight ahead in the same direction, you end up intersecting another short hallway coming from the right - near where the ticket desk is (aha, as I type this, I realize I should have said Ticket Desk and not Guest Services/Info). The wall on which those boot heaters are mounted separates the changing room from a small Employees Only room that lies between the changing room and the Ticket Desk. Whatever that room is and whatever function it has needs to be removed so that SB can enlarge the changing room - probably by a good 50%. It would also allow for easier access/egress for that room - the hallways in and out tend to get jammed up. Make better sense now?

[Lostone]

Yep, and that was what I had thought you were talking about.

If you follow that wall back to the lobby, you'll find the elevator, just beyond the door you are talking about. the room you are talking about contains the controls for said elevator.

(Actually, that is not what I had originally thought. Someone mentioned the post today, before I had seen it, and we wandered over to see what you might have been talking about. I thought he was referring to an older post.)

So I guess the upshot of all those words is that the room's half life has just been greatly increased. :wink: :lol:

[Tin Woodsman]

Yep, and that was what I had thought you were talking about.

If you follow that wall back to the lobby, you'll find the elevator, just beyond the door you are talking about. the room you are talking about contains the controls for said elevator.



So I guess the upshot of all those words is that the room's half life has just been greatly increased. :wink: :lol:

Oy. You ain't kiddin'. Well, there goes that idea.

[Strat]

Isn't there still a bit of a question as to what there is in the other side of the lodge (on both floors)? Especially the downstairs, the footprint of the building is too large for there not to be a lot more space in there....

[Lostone]

That is what I thought Tin meant!

I really don't know what that area is for.

I believe most of the bottom is food storage, and the top, storage and kitchen area.

I'm sure the bag area is being looked at, with an eye toward making things better. Bags around the cafeteria was one of the leading complaints, for years.


My own belief is, as stated above, that you should change where there is room, and just bring your bags down.

[random_ski_guy]

In the entry ways of the Gate House you will find a building floor plan which appears to be installed for fire code purposes. I took a good look at the plan, much of the mystery space on the north side is kitchen prep space; both upper and lower. It appears to be generous amount kitchen space...but I am no judge of what is appropriate.

[win]

Food storage both dry and cold for Gate House eateries and Timbers, utility room and some office space. The Prep kitchen for Timbers is also in the Gate House.

[Tin Woodsman]

Food storage both dry and cold for Gate House eateries and Timbers, utility room and some office space. The Prep kitchen for Timbers is also in the Gate House.

Does the construction of the Guest Services Lodge offer you any opportunities to move some of this space out of the GH Lodge? Even if not, has the possibility of expanding the boot/bag storage area been discussed in any level of detail? I understand you want to keep bags out of the upper level. I think it's silly, but I'm just one person. But expecting to modify human behavior such that people will, step by step, go upstairs to change, take their bags downstairs to store, then proceed out to go skiing, and vice versa when they leave - that's just crazy talk. We (humans) just don't work that way in a uniform basis, even if it might make more sense to do so. The upshot, if you continue to insist on no bags upstairs, is that the bag room is going to continue to be really, really crowded and annoying.

BTW, this thread is great, but it's drifted away from its intended purpose, so I'm going to attempt to split it out.

[random_ski_guy]

Food storage both dry and cold for Gate House eateries and Timbers, utility room and some office space. The Prep kitchen for Timbers is also in the Gate House.

Food Prep for Timber's in the Gatehouse...interesting.

[skigal]

I actually like the no bag left behind system. Don't have to move out the way while people look for their shoes and bags while I'm eating or taking off my boots. Don't have bags practically falling on me as people retrieve them from racks that are above my head. Yeah, I like it.

I don't actually use the boot room other than to drop off my back pack. Arrive at mountain, boot up upstairs, drop off pack on my way out. Reverse at the end of the day. I did pretty much the same thing in the old Gatehouse, storing my pack in the tent.

[Tin Woodsman]

I actually like the no bag left behind system. Don't have to move out the way while people look for their shoes and bags while I'm eating or taking off my boots. Don't have bags practically falling on me as people retrieve them from racks that are above my head. Yeah, I like it.

I don't actually use the boot room other than to drop off my back pack. Arrive at mountain, boot up upstairs, drop off pack on my way out. Reverse at the end of the day. I did pretty much the same thing in the old Gatehouse, storing my pack in the tent.

Which is great....for you. I suspect that the vast majority of SB customers didn't have this routine in place. Teaching it to them will be a long, slow, painful process. And even storing your stuff in the tent wasn't really what that space was intended for. It was supposed to be stored downstairs once they moved the Blazers etc... out of there. In short, you were still storing things in the cafeteria area, you were just doing it in a more remote part. That would be akin to storing your stuff in the narrow side room next to the cafeteria exit in the new lodge.

[aejkb]

The bag area debacle is amazing to me; after all that planning and money went in to the building , how could they screw up something as basic as making the changing/bag area a tiny 7th circle of hell. If you are a new visitor and prospective season ticket holder to Sugarbush and have to deal with that, I can't imagine that it would leave a favorable first impression; there is no room to change, or you get hit in the head if you are lucky enough to find a bench. There is not enough storage space after you figure out that you need to change upstairs and then bring bags down, and if you can find space, because there is such little floor space, everyone puts their wet boots on the shelf above your bag. Plus the whole experience makes for a horrible start to your morning --with tempers flaring at your fellow skiers and the hall monitors yelling at everyone, while PA system is screaming about not leaving bags upstairs. Someone should be drawn and quartered.

[TimKeogh]

Plus the whole experience makes for a horrible start to your morning --with tempers flaring at your fellow skiers and the hall monitors yelling at everyone, while PA system is screaming about not leaving bags upstairs.

I definitely agree with aejkb, that is why I will never park at LP again.

I find most people very gracious about making room/retrieving bags, etc... around the ME Lodge.
In fact, it is usually gets a conversation started with someone you'd otherwise not meet as you sit down for lunch or whatever.

[random_ski_guy]

I actually like the no bag left behind system. Don't have to move out the way while people look for their shoes and bags while I'm eating or taking off my boots. Don't have bags practically falling on me as people retrieve them from racks that are above my head. Yeah, I like it.

I don't actually use the boot room other than to drop off my back pack. Arrive at mountain, boot up upstairs, drop off pack on my way out. Reverse at the end of the day. I did pretty much the same thing in the old Gatehouse, storing my pack in the tent.

I like it too. I guess I'm in the minority (par the for course, okay with me). When you come into the lodge upstairs its nice not having to fumble over everyone's gear to sit down. I agree, the bag room should be bigger, but why change down there? why not change upstairs and then tuck the gear away downstairs on the way out.

It will be interesting to see what Stowe does with their new lodge at Spruce Peak.

[Tin Woodsman]

The bag area debacle is amazing to me; after all that planning and money went in to the building , how could they screw up something as basic as making the changing/bag area a tiny 7th circle of hell. If you are a new visitor and prospective season ticket holder to Sugarbush and have to deal with that, I can't imagine that it would leave a favorable first impression; there is no room to change, or you get hit in the head if you are lucky enough to find a bench. There is not enough storage space after you figure out that you need to change upstairs and then bring bags down, and if you can find space, because there is such little floor space, everyone puts their wet boots on the shelf above your bag. Plus the whole experience makes for a horrible start to your morning --with tempers flaring at your fellow skiers and the hall monitors yelling at everyone, while PA system is screaming about not leaving bags upstairs. Someone should be drawn and quartered.

Re-posted in its entirety for the sake of posterity. Seriously - this post nails it, really capturing the feeling of long-time loyalists and newcomers alike. I don't want to get into a "How could mgmt be so stupid!!" type thread. Rather, it's important to impart the perspective and experience of those who actually have to use this thing. It's a problem and will continue to be so unless either the policy changes or the room doubles (at least) in size. Not a great way to start out your morning or finish off the day. Going forward, to save my voice, I'm simply going to bring index cards with the word "sorry!" printed on them so I can hand them out to whomever I clock when I'm talking by. I hope that Win and Co. will take a serious look at this issue in the off-season. If the aforementioned office space can be moved somewhere else, please do so. Not sure how to get around the food storage for Timbers thing. You'd have to find space in Timbers/Clay Brook - don't know if that's available.

[MntMan4Bush]

I think that certainly us "veterans" if you will have a routine down that works for us when it's crowded in there (Coincidently 8 AM on a Sunday it is not crowded). However that is the first place that most people see when they come in and logically migrate towards it. Also the benches that are currently in there clearly indicate that the intent of the room is to be fuinctional and allow people to kit up in there otherwise they would just have more shelves/storage. Given that I think we're all just trying to state that the room was intended for one thing, but missed the mark and the whole thing needs to be rethought and tweaked a bit. I think at the very beginning there was a row of orange lockers in there that no one really used and ate up space they they deep sixed those and put in more shelves. A step in the right direction. Now we just need to open up some space somehow. Perhaps teh new guest services lodge will also have a large changing area and that's where a lot of people will go, but I know for me I stay close to where the beer is so I'll be in the VH lodge.

[tymoguls]

I find this thread interesting.

The emotions are clearly running high on this one. As an ME only passholder, I have not even ventured into the new changing and storage areas at LP. In contrast, I've never had a problem at ME. I head straight to the changing area, have never had to wait/fight for a seat, and there is plenty of co-located storage space. I probably shouldn't be saying any of this in a public forum. It would not be so pleasant if the LP croud tried to cram into the ME changing area.

I would be interested in getting an estimate of relative levels of morning traffic to the two base lodges. How many people does an LP changing/storage area need to accomodate relative to ME. The area at ME is only two benches, a sofa, something on the order of 40 lockers, a wall of cubbyholes, and a boot/glove warmer. Yet it seems to handle the crowd well. (Though, there is no prohibition on leaving bags in the general seating areas outside the changing area.)

I also find the "bags in the lodge" feature of most NE ski areas a refreshing alternative to the sterile atmospheres of the high-rent western areas. Wouldn't a plentiful supply of hooks/shelves above eye level get rid of the clutter under the tables?

[random_ski_guy]

I also find the "bags in the lodge" feature of most NE ski areas a refreshing alternative to the sterile atmospheres of the high-rent western areas. Wouldn't a plentiful supply of hooks/shelves above eye level get rid of the clutter under the tables?
not really enough wall space in the new gatehouse for the hooks. and a lodge full of bags will hold less people, thats what this is really all about. if the gh lodge is going to have better food, they need to keep the sales volume up and that means keeping seats free of as much gear as possible.

[MntMan4Bush]

I agree that when I go to North I never have a problem either. Apart from the few benches you mentioned the entire area is really open to sit and change with benches at every table and plenty of room to walk around. I toss my hiking boots on one of the shelves or under a table and I'm good to go. I usually don't go in for lunch as that's the time when lines are the smallest so I never really understood the hassle of sitting at a table with bags under it. Is it really that uncomfortable that you can't sit back an extra inch or two? I mean I'm 6'2" so I can certainly understand needing leg room, but I'm just curious. Perhaps tymoguls idea of shelves and hooks upstairs in the caf might be a soluton for all. I.e. downstairs have locking lockers for those who want to protect their valuables and upstairs have a bunch of shelves and stuff for those don't mind leaving thier stuff out. The shelves will keep stuff form out from under the table and funnel more people to go upstairs to change. Everyone wins. Of course teh way the upstairs is set up with long table coming out form the walls I can envision a lot of pushing and shoving to get to teh wall where your bags especially an issue around lunch time when people go in. Perhaps different table arrangement? Who knows.

[random_ski_guy]

I usually don't go in for lunch as that's the time when lines are the smallest so I never really understood the hassle of sitting at a table with bags under it. Is it really that uncomfortable that you can't sit back an extra inch or two? I mean I'm 6'2" so I can certainly understand needing leg room, but I'm just curious.

Yes, I do think it's unpleasant, but I could live with either arrangement (I’m 6'1''); bags in storage or bags under table. That being said, I don't feel very nice when my dirty ski boots are lapping against someone else's ski bag at lunch. I feel rude. And sometimes I find myself having to toss someone gear bag aside to make way. If you are skiing single or with just one partner, finding a table space in a lodge full of bags isn't so hard. When you're a group of four or more I find it can be much more difficult to find that table with a minimal amount of gear underfoot. Win is asking people to pay a decent sum for their lunch; I think the mtn is trying to match that tidy sum with a more comfortable dining experience. I do agree that the changing area and bag storage needs work however.

Now my turn, is changing upstairs and running your bag downstairs before you head out so hard? That "uncomfortable?" :)

Right now we have ME for those who like the old lodge feel and the GH for those who prefer the new lodge experience. Seems like the perfect salad bar of choices to me. Let the people sort themselves out as they see fit. I like diversity of experiences myself. Some days the ME lodge feels like the place to be, other days the new GH hits the spot.

Also, I think it’s a good bet that the new skier services building will try to alleviate the changing area issue. Isn't the plan to put seasonal lockers in there among other services? Tin probably knows, he probably has the constr. drawings.

[Tin Woodsman]

Yes, I do think it's unpleasant, but I could live with either arrangement (I’m 6'1''); bags in storage or bags under table. That being said, I don't feel very nice when my dirty ski boots are lapping against someone else's ski bag at lunch. I feel rude. And sometimes I find myself having to toss someone gear bag aside to make way. If you are skiing single or with just one partner, finding a table space in a lodge full of bags isn't so hard. When you're a group of four or more I find it can be much more difficult to find that table with a minimal amount of gear underfoot. Win is asking people to pay a decent sum for their lunch; I think the mtn is trying to match that tidy sum with a more comfortable dining experience. I do agree that the changing area and bag storage needs work however.

Now my turn, is changing upstairs and running your bag downstairs before you head out so hard? That "uncomfortable?" :)

Right now we have ME for those who like the old lodge feel and the GH for those who prefer the new lodge experience. Seems like the perfect salad bar of choices to me. Let the people sort themselves out as they see fit. I like diversity of experiences myself. Some days the ME lodge feels like the place to be, other days the new GH hits the spot.

Also, I think it’s a good bet that the new skier services building will try to alleviate the changing area issue. Isn't the plan to put seasonal lockers in there among other services? Tin probably knows, he probably has the constr. drawings.

[Sgt. schultz] I know nothing! [/sgt. shultz]

Really I don't. Though I'd imagine that feedback from this and other channels is invaluable in helping to decide what that building should have in it.

As for whether it's "uncomfortable" or not to have the morning routine as you describe - clearly not. But it's unfamiliar for veterans and newcomers alike, especially (for the latter group) considering that the bag room is the first thing they see when they walk in. When I boot up and get all zippered in, I want to get outside immediately or else I get hot and sweaty. That's good for tonight at home, not for Saturday's at 9:00 in the GH lodge. As such, I really would prefer not to walk downstairs with my bags, negotiate through the maze of people in that room, apologize 6 times, and then get outside to my skis. This is why the room downstairs last year was so great. Tons of room to do everything - change and hit the slopes directly. Don't pass Go. Don't collect $200.

[aejkb]

From what I am reading, it is odd that so many long time customers appear to prefer ME over LP. That raises some serious questions. I do not think that the reason is just because of some iconclastic preference for old vs. new. I think that before any further development, or demolition, goes forward, SV should get input from the people who have invested their lives, time and money into Sugarbush and the MRV. Not to tell SV what they can and cant do, but to make suggestions that would benefit SV, since it appears that some of the mistakes made in this phase were entirely avoidable and almost mind boggling. The opinions of skiers, parents,hosts of vistors and people who dont have endless supplies of $ (ie. me, the customer) should be sought--so that i will feel better after I almost get run over in a parking lot without pedestrian walkways, climb a 1000 stairs, put my boots on outside on a metal bench,wipe out on concrete walkways, try to find a place to store my stuff so my kids can find and reach their lunches, climb the hill to Valley House so I can sit for lunch, ski over random 2" pieces of granite that were so thoughtfully placed around the new lodge for landscaping. OK, I feel better now.

[random_ski_guy]

aejkb, I think thats what this board has become, a place for SV to collect / monitor input. Whether they want it or not, we're giving it to them.

[gone.skiing]

I can't believe another thread about bag storage is competing for top of the page with the thread about epic storm that is going on now...

For what it is worth I store my son's lunch in that room every Sat and Sun including holiday weeks. Without exception his ski instructor managed to find it and put it back for me to pick up at the end of the day. I ski with a number of parents that do the same thing and nobody makes such a big deal out of this. Is it inconvinient? Maybe... Should it be first thing on Win's agenda given the season they are having? I do not think so.

Lastly, if after skiing in conditions we had last couple of weekends you are leaving worrying about extra trip you had to take to throw you bag on the shelf your priorities are a little off.

[Tin Woodsman]

When you get off your soapbox, feel free to let us know how the skiing was today.

I wasn't aware that discussion of anything but the truly awesome conditions (and as MANY people have stated, it doesn't get better than this given the season we've had prior to today) we've had was forbidden or discouraged here. Thanks for the help in keeping us in line.

[random_ski_guy]

This thread has been dominated by those who aren't skiing today (tragic). This group isn't in position to talk about epic skiing, cause it ain't happening for us. I would love to read about though. Feel free to share.

[gone.skiing]

Tin, let's not go from guardrail to guardrail... There is one post above (I should have quoted it) which has too much negative content on the subject that has already been discussed multiple times. All I am saying this bag thing is not the end of the world as this thread makes it appear. This of course is my personal opinion.

[MntMan4Bush]

Your opinion is certainly valid, but so are the opinions of all the people above who commented each in their own style. If the issue was resolved to everyone's satisfaction then it would not be brought up again. I agree that it is not the end of the world and an inconvenience at best. The only thing I leave in there is my boots and the rest is on my back as I ski. I have my own routine which keeps me from crowded locker rooms, but I think we all want SB to be perfect and appealling to all, new and long time SB skiers. The fact is it is an issue that many are not happy with and will be brought up until it's fixed. That's one of teh great things about this forum. Take Timbers as an example. It had been mentioned several times, but Win came through and made some adjustments and we're all happier for it. There's always room for improvement, but in this forum we try and offer our opinions to make things better as we see it. It may not fit everyone's needs and therefor it's disregarded I understand and respect that. Another example is the cement outside taht everyone is slipping on. It's been brought up in about 4 different threads, but people keep falling. Should we stop mentioning it?

You are right that we should all be rejoicing about the snow though. I'm just stuck working and have nothing better to do than find a means to slack off. This forum is a great conduit. On Saturday and Sunday you won't see a single post from me. I promise.

[gone.skiing]

No argument on the concrete thing. I had a couple of near misses myself. How about "make sure you have your helmets on" sign at the top of the stairs as a temporary solution? :shock:

[Tin Woodsman]

Tin, let's not go from guardrail to guardrail... There is one post above (I should have quoted it) which has too much negative content on the subject that has already been discussed multiple times. All I am saying this bag thing is not the end of the world as this thread makes it appear. This of course is my personal opinion.

Agreed on all counts. I assure you that if I could get off work today and play in the snow up there, I wouldn't be mentioning anything about the bag room.

[Mike_451]

The bag room was obviously too small the second I saw it on opening day. Some Architect screwed up big time, probably used the formula for a coat closet to determine square footage.

[freeheel_skier]

The bag room was obviously too small the second I saw it on opening day. Some Architect screwed up big time, probably used the formula for a coat closet to determine square footage.

What is the formula for a coat closet? :roll:

[sugarboarder]

:lol: :lol: :lol:

[Yard Sale]

The bag room was obviously too small the second I saw it on opening day. Some Architect screwed up big time, probably used the formula for a coat closet to determine square footage.

What is the formula for a coat closet? :roll:

Depends on the coat check girl.

[Lostone]

The coat check girl is wearing Depends? :?

Is she an astronaut? :shock:


:lol:

[Yard Sale]

The coat check girl is wearing Depends? :?

Is she an astronaut? :shock:


:lol:

I suppose this well prepared lass may indeed be outfitted for a trip to seventh planet from the sun. :oops: God-speed woman! :shock:

[sugarboarder]

The coat check girl is wearing Depends? :?

Is she an astronaut? :shock:


:lol:

I suppose this well prepared lass may indeed be outfitted for a trip to seventh planet from the sun. :oops: God-speed woman! :shock:

Or a trip to knife her EX!!! :shock:

[freeheel_skier]

The coat check girl is wearing Depends? :?

Is she an astronaut? :shock:


:lol:

I suppose this well prepared lass may indeed be outfitted for a trip to seventh planet from the sun. :oops: God-speed woman! :shock:

Or a trip to knife her EX!!! :shock:

Or maybe it snowed 4' and she skied all day without stopping..... :shock: :lol: