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View Full Version : Jan 20 - Mt Ellen staff flip flops



TOS
01-22-2007, 06:31 PM
Saturday morning the snow phone said that if lifts were on windhold, hiking up was an option.
Get to Mt Ellen, ride the Northridge up and hike up Rim Run. There a patroler was refusing to let people
ski down anything, except back down Rim Run. If we returned, our passes would be pulled.

Later on a friend of mine and his buddys skin up, meet a patroller. They tell him that they are headed up to ski the
summit. The patroller tells them just to check in when they
are leaving. This is when all the lifts are on wind hold.

What is going on here? Where is the consistency in the message we are getting?
Don't tell us we can hike up and then change your mind when we get there.
If you are going to have restrictions, shouldn't they apply to all customers?

We weren't a group of "Joeys". I would say my was for the most part, are stronger skiers then the group that
was allowed to continue. The group that was turned away were season pass holders, the group that was allowed to
continue refer to Sugarbush as "Mascara Mountain".

I have to say I am very upset over this. Are all the patrollers adlibbing?

win
01-22-2007, 07:28 PM
We will allow hiking and skiing down trails cleared by patrol when we have patrol stationed on top of the trails when there is windhold or a lift delay. For instance, on Sunday when North Lynx had a delayed opening, we allowed hiking because patrol was stationed up top. If a trail is closed by patrol that is a different issue and passes will be pulled. This is for safety and liablity reasons. There should not be any inconsistency, so I will check to see why different patrollers gave different answers.

sugarboarder
01-22-2007, 07:41 PM
Saturday morning the snow phone said that if lifts were on windhold, hiking up was an option.
Get to Mt Ellen, ride the Northridge up and hike up Rim Run. There a patroler was refusing to let people
ski down anything, except back down Rim Run. If we returned, our passes would be pulled.

Later on a friend of mine and his buddys skin up, meet a patroller. They tell him that they are headed up to ski the
summit. The patroller tells them just to check in when they
are leaving. This is when all the lifts are on wind hold.

What is going on here? Where is the consistency in the message we are getting?
Don't tell us we can hike up and then change your mind when we get there.
If you are going to have restrictions, shouldn't they apply to all customers?

We weren't a group of "Joeys". I would say my was for the most part, are stronger skiers then the group that
was allowed to continue. The group that was turned away were season pass holders, the group that was allowed to
continue refer to Sugarbush as "Mascara Mountain".

I have to say I am very upset over this. Are all the patrollers adlibbing?

Man I long for the "old days"...please, please, please MRG...if I can prove to you that I know how to "carve" and that I am a "regular person" and not some "stoned out jibber no-mind" - and I was a SKIER for 20+ years...will you let me in????

Strat
01-22-2007, 08:05 PM
Saturday morning the snow phone said that if lifts were on windhold, hiking up was an option.
Get to Mt Ellen, ride the Northridge up and hike up Rim Run. There a patroler was refusing to let people
ski down anything, except back down Rim Run. If we returned, our passes would be pulled.

Later on a friend of mine and his buddys skin up, meet a patroller. They tell him that they are headed up to ski the
summit. The patroller tells them just to check in when they
are leaving. This is when all the lifts are on wind hold.

What is going on here? Where is the consistency in the message we are getting?
Don't tell us we can hike up and then change your mind when we get there.
If you are going to have restrictions, shouldn't they apply to all customers?

We weren't a group of "Joeys". I would say my was for the most part, are stronger skiers then the group that
was allowed to continue. The group that was turned away were season pass holders, the group that was allowed to
continue refer to Sugarbush as "Mascara Mountain".

I have to say I am very upset over this. Are all the patrollers adlibbing?

Man I long for the "old days"...please, please, please MRG...if I can prove to you that I know how to "carve" and that I am a "regular person" and not some "stoned out jibber no-mind" - and I was a SKIER for 20+ years...will you let me in????
That's a bad road to go down... bringing it up I mean...

BushMogulMaster
01-22-2007, 08:20 PM
and I was a SKIER for 20+ years...will you let me in????

Then put your skis on :lol:

freeheel_skier
01-22-2007, 09:47 PM
and I was a SKIER for 20+ years...will you let me in????

Then put your skis on :lol:

Split board & Skins problem solved!

sugarboarder
01-22-2007, 11:22 PM
Man I long for the "old days"...please, please, please MRG...if I can prove to you that I know how to "carve" and that I am a "regular person" and not some "stoned out jibber no-mind" - and I was a SKIER for 20+ years...will you let me in????
That's a bad road to go down... bringing it up I mean...

Why do you say that? I'm not being nasty or anything. :?

sugarboarder
01-22-2007, 11:24 PM
and I was a SKIER for 20+ years...will you let me in????

Then put your skis on :lol:

No chance - sold 'em 15 years ago...Rossi 4S 203's and 3G 207's. :)

sugarboarder
01-22-2007, 11:25 PM
and I was a SKIER for 20+ years...will you let me in????

Then put your skis on :lol:

Split board & Skins problem solved!

Does MRG allow split boards? I don't think so.

Strat
01-23-2007, 07:23 AM
Man I long for the "old days"...please, please, please MRG...if I can prove to you that I know how to "carve" and that I am a "regular person" and not some "stoned out jibber no-mind" - and I was a SKIER for 20+ years...will you let me in????
That's a bad road to go down... bringing it up I mean...

Why do you say that? I'm not being nasty or anything. :?

I dunno, I've just seen the debate deteriorate into all-out nastiness, though I suppose that was on forums that were generally less cordial than this one...

sugarboarder
01-23-2007, 09:34 AM
Man I long for the "old days"...please, please, please MRG...if I can prove to you that I know how to "carve" and that I am a "regular person" and not some "stoned out jibber no-mind" - and I was a SKIER for 20+ years...will you let me in????
That's a bad road to go down... bringing it up I mean...

Why do you say that? I'm not being nasty or anything. :?

I dunno, I've just seen the debate deteriorate into all-out nastiness, though I suppose that was on forums that were generally less cordial than this one...

Yeah, and I know there is ZERO chance of that ever happening (my original request) so it was said tongue in cheek - and I really was mostly pointing out that I prefer the "feel" of ME and MRG as far as the lodges etc. - but I am also one of a select company of snowboarders who don't scrape snow off the hill (be it in hard boots or soft) and actually understand what "carve" means.

PS - The ME staff not ony flip-flops...I saw them doing handstands the other day in the parking lot!

CapeSkiGuy
01-23-2007, 09:42 AM
I think we have two separate issues here. If there is a windhold, and a skier wants to hike up, (it won't be me!) then that creates an entirely different situation than a trail or area being closed by Patrol. Two situations, two responses.

Of course, clear communication is needed. Nobody likes windholds, and the policies need to be uniform or paying guests get P.O.'d. Anyone who attempts to hike up should be told the same thing by Patrol. Presumably, instructions are communicated by radio, so there can be a unity of command. This can be a rapidly changing situation, and conditions can vary across the resort, so it will never be perfect.

Closed areas/trails/makeshift jumps, etc. are different. Disregarding the instructions of a patroller is very serious. This can often be an ad-hoc situation requiring an on-scene, rapid decision that may displease a paying guest. Safety must come first, and allowing people to ignore the instructions of a patroller places the resort in a difficult situation. Authority is lost, and liability is increased if injury to a guest results. The reasonable response to this is to pull the ticket of the person who disobeys a patroller. Never to be done lightly, but "pulling" is probably the only real enforcement tool that a patroller has in the case of willful disregard.

I will never criticize a patroller who, in the absence of other information, makes a decision in favor of safety. Consider the liability resulting from the alternative. I don't want to see anyone unhappy on the mountain, especially if they have paid big money to be there, but decisions like this are the only real barrier a resort has against personal injury lawyers and large legal settlements that jeopardize our sport. The mountain has to be proactive toward safety issues.

01-23-2007, 11:11 AM
There should not be any inconsistency, so I will check to see why different patrollers gave different answers.
I love it how Win takes feedback here so seriously and then goes to lay down the law when needed. :lol:

ski_resort_observer
01-23-2007, 11:30 AM
I prefer the "feel" of ME and MRG as far as the lodges etc.
PS - The ME staff not ony flip-flops...I saw them doing handstands the other day in the parking lot!

BMM has posted some very cool old pics at www.sugarbushhistory.com and one of the most interesting is an old pic of the Green Mountain Lodge. I don't think there was a date listed but it looks pretty brand new. I love the easy access both inside and espicailly outside to hang out on the back deck relaxing after skiing or even a midday break with a beer or cup of coffee.

On the handstand thing, if it was last Sat, that might have been me but it was the wind that caused that as I normally can't do a handstand to save my life. :lol:

TOS
01-23-2007, 11:51 AM
There should not be any inconsistency, so I will check to see why different patrollers gave different answers.
I love it how Win takes feedback here so seriously and then goes to lay down the law when needed. :lol:

I agree, I love his hands on approach. I like seeing him around. Makes me feel like I ski at a place where the owner cares about skiing,
not just the bottom line. I started sking at SB during the ASC days. Things are so much better now.

CapeSkiGuy - let me say, we never considered disobeying the patrol.
We didn't set out to break the rules, we were going on the information we had been given.
To be turned back was upsetting. Then to find out later that others were allowed to. . .

As I said, we are pass holders and we want to get along with the patrol.
A lot of them are great people and amazing skiers.

CapeSkiGuy
01-23-2007, 12:11 PM
Tos, I didn't mean to imply that you did. I understand your frustration at being told one thing, then another. I hope you enjoyed the rest of the day. Sorry for the confusion.

I know from personal experience that it is very frustrating to be told you can't do X by a person in authority, then later on, someone else gets to do it. I don't blame you one bit for being aggravated, especially after you hiked. (which is more than I am willing to do!)

I only want to point out that sometimes these situations are caused by a changing set of circumstances, a miscommunication, or other mixup. Usually these things get sorted out promptly. I hope that next time you have better luck. As for me, I will be inside with a beer, waiting for the windhold to be lifted. I am far too lazy to hike up the hill, and I admire your determination. :D

freeheel_skier
01-24-2007, 03:21 AM
Hiking was allowed if the lifts were on wind hold per the ski report. I don't understand why you can't hike it lifts aren't running in Jan vs. lifts not running in Oct./Nov.? You are on your own...what gives? :?