Anyone Else Travel to Killington for Early Season?

[Ride Delaware ?]

I know this is a random question to ask, but being that Sugarbush is a relatively easy 55 minute drive north of Killington on Rt. 100, does anyone use their Sugarbush accommodations/residence as a base of operations for a different mountain early season? I only single out Killington because it is known for its early season opening and on average has opened 2-3 weeks ahead of Sugarbush in the past. I made the drive down there twice last year on November 8th and 9th (weekdays), and it was a wonderful experience. They were making snow and it was relatively uncrowded despite the limited terrain of the NRT. It was an excellent opportunity to work out the kinks and break in some new gear. I was just wondering how many other people take advantage of the early season down there.

[jwt]

Many on this list do that RD. I can be found there at least once or twice depending on SB opening. Similar with Sunday River - just not as accessible for NY/NJ/CT - or Mad River Valley folks.

If it's white, it's alright no matter where it is. K-Mart does a decent job that early and has thr traffic to help pay for it. Bush wouldn't pan out financially, just not enough people to make it work. Of course, that's why so many of us come to the valley in the 1st place.

[southvillager]

On years that I do not buy a season pass for Sugarbush, we will sometimes ski Sugarbush on Saturdays, then head to Killington to ski Sunday. Not just early in the season. My ride home from Killington is shorter. Yes, early/late conditions are typically better at Killington. But as I succumb to middle age, I find the crowds at Killington to be hard to take.

[Ride Delaware ?]

Many on this list do that RD. I can be found there at least once or twice depending on SB opening. Similar with Sunday River - just not as accessible for NY/NJ/CT - or Mad River Valley folks.

If it's white, it's alright no matter where it is. K-Mart does a decent job that early and has thr traffic to help pay for it. Bush wouldn't pan out financially, just not enough people to make it work. Of course, that's why so many of us come to the valley in the 1st place.
I think it is like anything, supply vs demand.

Early season is an expensive endeavor for any mountain. Snowmaking is expensive, especially at marginal temps, and you run the risk of losing that expensive product with early season temperature swings.

There is a huge pent up demand at the beginning of the season, but those people craving early season turns are a small percentage of the skiing public. It is enough to keep a couple resorts in different markets busy (SR/K-Mart), but if there would be multiple mountains in a small geographic area, it would disperse the crowds and not be financially worth it for anyone. K-Mart happens to have the perfect storm for an early season opening. They are centrally located in VT with easy access to major population centers, they have the largest skier base in the east which subsequently means they have the largest season pass base allowing for early season snowmaking funds, they have a good early season setup (not ideal with the stairway to heaven), and they have elevation. Since I usually only hit K-Mart on weekdays early season, I usually don't have to worry about the crowds. I know some people give K-Mart a bad rep, but early season, it fits just right. It's convenience makes it a no brainer. Furthermore, they usually off early season BOGO vouchers to make it more affordable. I for one am quite happy we have Killington so close.

I know plenty of people here complain about the lack of early season snowmaking (or snowmaking in general), and I am sure that it is justified to a certain degree. We dish out a ton of money on passes in order to ski at Sugarbush and it would be nice to maximize the season. However, while it would be much more convenient to have a two minute drive to the LP parking lot, I'd much rather drive to K-Mart (I have a gas efficient ish SUV), than have even more money tacked onto my SB pass. We are very fortunate to have so many other resorts relatively close to SB. It gives us options. During the early season, I'm glad one of those is Killington.

As for Sunday River, I love the place. I worked there the past two years and called it home. Despite that, it's not worth the 3 hour drive from SB to SR if K-Mart is up and running. It's even less worth it if the skiing and riding is only off the Locke Triple with uploading and downloading. Their setup is just not as efficient and they lack the elevation to blow as efficiently as K-Mart. One of the things I like about K-Mart is that there are up to 9 distinctive trails off the NRT which has roughly 600 foot vert. In a marginal early season, it is nice to have that variety.

By contrast, the Locke triple only accesses 3-400 feet and only has 2 trail segments. Once those two segments are open, expansion has to be t2b. Last year was an exception to the rule. They opened a couple days after K-Mart, and by their second day were offering t2b riding on Sunday Punch. The weather cooperated and they were able to make it happen. K-Mart wasn't t2b for another week, but their coverage scheme allowed for quicker expansion once they were.

Lastly, K-Mart also attempts to stay open 7 days a week once they open. If the weather forces then to, they will close midweek. SR often opens weekends only until mid November when the crowds start to get heavier. Overall, it's a crapshoot. I'm just glad we have some options. I just wish SR wasn't a 3 hour drive.

[Hawk]

RD, we ski both K and SR from opening day no mater what the conditions. It is just a matter of what is going on those early weenends. I have the luxury of having many good friends that own at both mountains. Originally I skied SR for my first 17 or so years of skiing but alway came to VT for a few weekends or on day trips. Once ASC bought Sugarbush, the season passes made it easy to come more often. Then about 10 years ago we made the perminent switch because it became borring sking SR groomers and Sugarbush had great woods, endless bumps, awsome vibe and it seemed to snow everytime we went there! :-).

People on here see my snowmaking rants as picking on the management for something that costs too much. Most miss the point entirely. I have long given up on the early openings as it will never happen. I will always be a champion for upgrading the system to do a better job. Most people on here think that they do a great job early season with the snow making. I just disagree becasue I have seen what good snow making really is. I also understand the value of the ability to recover quickly after a thaw. It is the only thing that I think Sugarbush lacks. To be totally honest, all the lodge confiuration gripes, lunch crowds and lift issues do not really concern me. Skiing icy trails with a thin coating of snowmaking after a rain does. See you at Killington in a few weeks. ;-)

[Ride Delaware ?]

SR has one of the best snowmaking systems in the world. Once you see it running at full capacity, it's not fair to compare it to anyone else. It's simply tough to beat their system. Like you said, there are trade offs, and it will be a little difficult to get used to, but I think I'll get used to double the snowfall just fine.

See you in a couple weeks

[jwt]

Those other resorts keep the Bush crowds down - a key reason many of us come here and purchased RE here. Sure we want the mountain to be profitable, can't stay in business it it isn't, but having those other choices keep the vibe in the valley well, the vibe.

We won't ever have the s/m capacity of those two - ever. They will never have Lake Champlain either, nor the almost perfectly situated bowls that make up most of north and south. We won't ever have the beds they have at the base, ever.

I like the trade offs. Apparently more and more people do because the valley is slowly growing despite the ridiculous tax rates. It just squeezes out more of the middle class but my guess is K-Mart is worse and S/R is simply too low and too far.

Here's to a snowy and safe winter.

And early skiing at the Mart

[Hawk]

The war drums are beating. Looks like Killington and Sunday River are both thnking about this weekend. My money is with K.

[Ride Delaware ?]

The war drums are beating. Looks like Killington and Sunday River are both thnking about this weekend. My money is with K.
As usual, there is always a debate as to what is a legit opening, who stays open, quality of terrain etc, but all that aside, I think they both have the potential to open this weekend. K will have the better temps and has a chance to stay open while SR will likely close midweek. However, I think I heard that Killington may only open for SPs and Express Card holders again, then close until a couple more trails can be opened.

Doesn't matter to me as long as the temps keep dropping and mountains keep getting closer to opening.

[Ride Delaware ?]

It's official!!! The 2013/2014 Vermont ski season will begin tomorrow at Killington. Killington made snow around the clock yesterday and will be making snow as temperatures permit for the foreseeable future. Killington will open tomorrow for Season Pass Holders and Express Card holders and Saturday for the general public. No word on whether they will stay open midweek.

Looks like tomorrow's visitors will have to walk the stairway to and from the NRT while they plan to have Great Northern open on Saturday for ski out. Temps look to moderate in a week or so, but they should be able to get enough snow down by then to weather the storm.

I'd like to get up there ASAP, but it looks like work will keep me away until at least the 5th of November. I love early starts to the season, but it sucks not being able to partake. Somebody get out there for me.

[Hawk]

I will be up this weekend and plan to be at Killington at opening on Saturday. Sunday River will also be open but route 2 shuffle over there is quite the haul.

[Ride Delaware ?]

I will be up this weekend and plan to be at Killington at opening on Saturday. Sunday River will also be open but route 2 shuffle over there is quite the haul.
I can at least confirm that through the unofficial rumor mill. I still have some friends that work there who have been told to be ready to work on the snow come Friday. Unfortunately, Sunday River has been pretty quiet through social media so far.

[Hawk]

My SR sources work in Lift ops and snowmaking. They say the only question is are they going to be top to bottom. Right now it looks like to the midstation only. I would not be surprised if they open up today at 3:00 for the locals to bust K-tons balls. Not really an opening but they love to say they were first.

[Ride Delaware ?]

My SR sources work in Lift ops and snowmaking. They say the only question is are they going to be top to bottom. Right now it looks like to the midstation only. I would not be surprised if they open up today at 3:00 for the locals to bust K-tons balls. Not really an opening but they love to say they were first.
If it is t2b, coverage is going to be thin. They offered an excellent t2b product last year on the second official day, but temps were much colder and held longer. There were also colder temperatures in the forecast, and it was nearly 10 days later. I don't see it happening. If that were still my home, I wouldn't care. Whether its Sunday Punch and T2, or t2b, its still skiing in October.

[Hawk]

Killington opened today at 1:30 so I guess they had better temps and won the marketing contest. BTW - I was there last year so we skiied together Dude.

[Ride Delaware ?]

Killington opened today at 1:30 so I guess they had better temps and won the marketing contest. BTW - I was there last year so we skiied together Dude.
Bummer I missed you. It was a great treat last year. Awesome that K was able to open so early. Make sure to post a couple pics on Saturday for those of us less fortunate. Let the season begin!!!

[southvillager]

Another option is Stowe. They claim to have purchased around 450 tower guns, 150 regular guns, and 20 fans in the past 2 years. They don't seem to be promising an early opening, but with all that new gear they may offer superior coverage.

[Ride Delaware ?]

It looks like you made the right decision to go to Killington Hawk. Temps look to be holding and snowmaking is still in progress. Unfortunately, Sunday River is not so fortunate. I have copied and pasted one of the most brutal and honest Mountain Reports I have seen in some time.

Today at Sunday River
We’re still aiming to open tomorrow, but the weather has taken a turn for the worse. As such, we’re going to make the call tomorrow at 6:30 a.m. as to whether or now we can open, and here are the reasons why:

It’s much warmer than any of us expected, snowmaking has stopped, temperatures do not look favorable moving forward, leaving each and every one of us thinking: we’ll be damned if we go back on our word to you about tomorrow being opening day. If there was ever a testament to the dedication of our teams to you, it was illustrated just 20 minutes ago by 20 plus men boarding the Locke Mountain Triple. They weren’t going up to ski first tracks, they were going up there to physically move snow in time for tomorrow’s opening day. None of us are ready to admit defeat, but there’s a chance that we may.

So what does this mean? It means that despite our snowmaking efforts since Tuesday, we’ve made significant process, however there will be walking to the mid-station in addition to downloading to the base. It means that we’ll continue to make snow when we can, but it’s going to take a miracle to make the amount of snow most of you are used to expecting. It means that the coverage is variable, so when we say for advanced skiers and snowboarders only, we really really mean it. It means that opening day conditions are nowhere near our standards, despite even our best efforts. And finally, it means that even if we’re able to open tomorrow, we need to set some expectations.

So…if you’re looking for tremendous conditions and ample snow coverage—get ready for the most honest snow report assessment maybe, like, ever—this weekend isn’t for you. If you want to come up, check things out, ski a little, and check out our progress, come on up and say hello.

Keep thinking cold thoughts and we’ll continue to too. Tomorrow’s update will be here at 6:30 a.m. tomorrow.

Sincerely,
Team Snow

[HowieT2]

Another option is Stowe. They claim to have purchased around 450 tower guns, 150 regular guns, and 20 fans in the past 2 years. They don't seem to be promising an early opening, but with all that new gear they may offer superior coverage.

I think Stowe, like sugarbush, doesn't play the first to open game. My understanding is that neither consider to even start making snow before 11/1 and then barring help from Mother Nature wont open till mid November.

[HowieT2]

It looks like you made the right decision to go to Killington Hawk. Temps look to be holding and snowmaking is still in progress. Unfortunately, Sunday River is not so fortunate. I have copied and pasted one of the most brutal and honest Mountain Reports I have seen in some time.

Today at Sunday River
We’re still aiming to open tomorrow, but the weather has taken a turn for the worse. As such, we’re going to make the call tomorrow at 6:30 a.m. as to whether or now we can open, and here are the reasons why:

It’s much warmer than any of us expected, snowmaking has stopped, temperatures do not look favorable moving forward, leaving each and every one of us thinking: we’ll be damned if we go back on our word to you about tomorrow being opening day. If there was ever a testament to the dedication of our teams to you, it was illustrated just 20 minutes ago by 20 plus men boarding the Locke Mountain Triple. They weren’t going up to ski first tracks, they were going up there to physically move snow in time for tomorrow’s opening day. None of us are ready to admit defeat, but there’s a chance that we may.

So what does this mean? It means that despite our snowmaking efforts since Tuesday, we’ve made significant process, however there will be walking to the mid-station in addition to downloading to the base. It means that we’ll continue to make snow when we can, but it’s going to take a miracle to make the amount of snow most of you are used to expecting. It means that the coverage is variable, so when we say for advanced skiers and snowboarders only, we really really mean it. It means that opening day conditions are nowhere near our standards, despite even our best efforts. And finally, it means that even if we’re able to open tomorrow, we need to set some expectations.

So…if you’re looking for tremendous conditions and ample snow coverage—get ready for the most honest snow report assessment maybe, like, ever—this weekend isn’t for you. If you want to come up, check things out, ski a little, and check out our progress, come on up and say hello.

Keep thinking cold thoughts and we’ll continue to too. Tomorrow’s update will be here at 6:30 a.m. tomorrow.

Sincerely,
Team Snow

Hence, why the other mountains don't rush into making snow in October. It appears the resources they expended in trying to beat kton, will be for naught. We are all anxious but shall have no wine before it's time.

[Ride Delaware ?]

Hence, why the other mountains don't rush into making snow in October. It appears the resources they expended in trying to beat kton, will be for naught. We are all anxious but shall have no wine before it's time.
I completely agree. It's a pure business decision. If they want to undertake the incredible cost and risk of opening early season, good for them. It definitely helps jumpstart the season by bringing in revenue to surrounding businesses by filling hotel rooms and providing mouths to feed. It also puts seasonal workers back to work. Killington also has the benefit of being easily accessible from the major markets of Boston, NY/NJ, and to a lesser extent Albany. It's a basic case of supply vs demand, and early in the season, demand is very high and supply is very low. They have put their asses on the line to open and their risk should be rewarded. Knowing that snowmaking isn't cheap, and there could still be a warmup causing them to lose the snow, I think $49 is a fair price. No way would I pay that for the NRT midseason, but to work the jones out, I'm game.

Killington has a bunch of factors going for it when it comes to early season opening. Would it be awesome to have some early season at LP or ME? Yes. Will it happen? No, it's not their business plan. Do I have an excellent resort with a will to open early season an hour south of me? Yes. Will I give them business until SB opens? Yes. Am I complaining? No, I knew what I was getting when I moved to Sugarbush. Am I incredibly excited that the season is underway even though I'm not there to enjoy it? Absolutely.

[Hawk]

Killington was actually 20% off with my Sugarbush pass. I guess there are also 2 for 1's out there if you sign up for the news letter. We skied Saturday for $39.
I got a call from one of my buddys at Sunday River on Saturday morning. He was telling me not to waste my time coming. When I told him I was on the lift at Killington he laughed and said well played. They did ski over there but from all reports they just didn't have the temps to pound it out. I posted a small trip report on the other thred. Killington was very good with great coverage.

[Treeskier]

Good one Hawk. Was thinking of it all weekend as I toiled away.

[Hawk]

I totally expected to see you Tree. I saw and skied with a few from the Bush. Good to see people and get out.

[Ride Delaware ?]

I should have been there today through wed, but I have to go back up to check on the renovations on the 7th, so I figured I would save the 9 hour drive for then. Really kicking myself in the ass since the long range forecast doesn't look desirable at all. Should have been there.

[JayBird]

Sugarbush is nice and all, but when does it open ?
K has been skiing for 3 weeks and they open SuperStar today.

Chomping at the bit ... and don't have reliable wheels.