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View Full Version : Snowmaking on Lower Birdland????



summitchallenger
11-30-2010, 04:17 AM
I was downloading the other day and call me crazy, but did I notice that the snowmaking lines and hydrants have been removed from Lower Birdland? I recall a line with hydrants running on skier's left of that trail...complete with foam shield barriers...and now there is nothing. What is the story?

Hawk
11-30-2010, 05:27 AM
Summit, I can't say for sure and did not notice this but I can guess. There was talk that some leaks in the system were fixed this year early on. I would imagine with the lack of use on that section of trail, they may have had more problems than worth fixing and just desided to get rid of it. Not a big loss as they really don't blow that section very often. Again just a guess.

HowieT2
11-30-2010, 06:18 AM
Summit, I can't say for sure and did not notice this but I can guess. There was talk that some leaks in the system were fixed this year early on. I would imagine with the lack of use on that section of trail, they may have had more problems than worth fixing and just desided to get rid of it. Not a big loss as they really don't blow that section very often. Again just a guess.

Agreed.

summitchallenger
11-30-2010, 08:24 AM
OK, I can understand if this line was leaky and was removed, but why reduce the amount of terrain covered by snowmaking and why keep the "*" by the trail name if there is no more infrastructure on it?

Tin Woodsman
11-30-2010, 09:37 AM
Summit, I can't say for sure and did not notice this but I can guess. There was talk that some leaks in the system were fixed this year early on. I would imagine with the lack of use on that section of trail, they may have had more problems than worth fixing and just desided to get rid of it. Not a big loss as they really don't blow that section very often. Again just a guess.

In my 15 years skiing at SB, I've never seen them blow on that trail. Never understood why, as that rocky section could use a good coating of sticky man-made at times, but it's certainly not going to change anything in reality.

That said, they should take away the snowmaking trail designation on the site if it's still there.

shadyjay
11-30-2010, 01:10 PM
Haven't noticed whether or not the line on Lower Birdland is there or not.

Looking back at some older trail maps, several trails at Mt Ellen had the * snowmaking symbol next to them but I don't recall ever seeing such capabilities on the trails. Check out this map: http://sugarbushhistory.com/1994-1995.jpg and you'll see the * next to Upper Lookin' Good and Hammerhead. Also, Lower Brambles I think still has snowmaking but since the upper/lower designation has since been removed, the * has been omitted.

PS - I really like the Mt Ellen map in the image linked above which better shows its trail layout, especially Northway. Now that the Mt Ellen map is completely eliminated from the Lincoln Peak side, it would be nice to go back to the 1994-1995 ME map.

flakeydog
11-30-2010, 02:03 PM
I think these trails had snowmaking from "drag-over". For example, Upper looking Good could be blasted from the top and bottom from guns dragged from Rim Run, and maybe one in the middle dragged through a thinner section of woods there. Hammerhead could be blasted from the top with quite a bit of snow funneled down the headwall. They even dragged hoses over from Elbow to coat the headwall on Bravo on occasion. You get the idea.... whatever they could do to put more of the ' * ' next to trails, the better.

slatham
11-30-2010, 05:04 PM
flakeydog has it right, they would drag guns and hoses through the woods to make snow on the adjacent trails without actual snowmaking pipe. Lots of areas do this.

However, they didn't have to do this on Bravo. They have one branch of pipes that run through the woods from Elbow to the headwall at Bravo. You can see the pipes from the lift, on the left (skiers right), just at the crest of the headwall. Can't say I've seen it used, but my brother-in-law that once worked snowmaking said it has been. With the headwall covered Bravo could open on limited natural.

And yes, that old map of North is much better than the current map! Bring it back!

Think Snow :D

win
11-30-2010, 05:07 PM
Snow has not been made on this trail for year for the simple fact that it is too close to the lift. Pipe was put in years ago and never used, so we took the pipe from Lower Birdland and used it to replace the pipe on Gondolier which had aged and experienced a few breaks last year.

random_ski_guy
11-30-2010, 07:20 PM
Win, does this mean lower birdland no longer has snowmaking or in the off chance you want to make snow on this run, you could still do so by dragging long hose lines from lower organgrinder?

summitchallenger
12-01-2010, 04:28 AM
Snow has not been made on this trail for year for the simple fact that it is too close to the lift. Pipe was put in years ago and never used, so we took the pipe from Lower Birdland and used it to replace the pipe on Gondolier which had aged and experienced a few breaks last year.

That's what I wondered because I noticed that Gondolier had two lines on it--one on either side--and it looked good.

summitchallenger
12-01-2010, 04:29 AM
I also prefer the 1994-1995 Mount Ellen map as well!

win
12-04-2010, 03:06 PM
We could drag guns but it is unlikely. I do not foresee us making snow on Lower Birdland.

summitchallenger
12-04-2010, 07:17 PM
Honestly Lower Birdland is one of my least favorite trails. It gets wind scoured and the ledges make it nasty. Not to mention that you have the peanut gallery watching you. At any rate, I did notice that Gondolier has new snowmaking line, so FWIW that was a good move. That route is pretty important now for early and late season.

I must say that the snow on Downspout and Organgrinder held up very well today to the traffic.

random_ski_guy
12-04-2010, 07:31 PM
Honestly Lower Birdland is one of my least favorite trails. It gets wind scoured and the ledges make it nasty. Not to mention that you have the peanut gallery watching you. At any rate, I did notice that Gondolier has new snowmaking line, so FWIW that was a good move. That route is pretty important now for early and late season.

I must say that the snow on Downspout and Organgrinder held up very well today to the traffic.

Funny, I have the opposite opinion. I like lower birdland. I like skiing the junk underneath the chairlift. Especially junk that for whatever reason; double fall line, wind scour, high traffic, becomes skinny. The added pressure of the audience gets my juices flowing. I often find the best snow on the mountain is found under the chairlift.

Tin Woodsman
12-05-2010, 12:30 AM
Honestly Lower Birdland is one of my least favorite trails. It gets wind scoured and the ledges make it nasty. Not to mention that you have the peanut gallery watching you. At any rate, I did notice that Gondolier has new snowmaking line, so FWIW that was a good move. That route is pretty important now for early and late season.

I must say that the snow on Downspout and Organgrinder held up very well today to the traffic.
The added pressure of the audience gets my juices flowing. I often find the best snow on the mountain is found under the chairlift.

I would agree with the last part, but definitely not the first, IMHO. Birdland is always wind scoured, with a rock always waiting to give you a core shot. I am only on that trail, and briefly at that, when coming out of something or going to something else.

Yard Sale
12-05-2010, 03:21 PM
Birdland is one of my favorites. Thick or thin it is almost always a great ride. It's a natural terrain park.
As far as core shots go, like my knees, my skis are a wear items to be replaced when they wear out.

:lol: